Books CRUCIBLE by Troy Denning: The Official Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Im on a tablet bro or Id help ya, its been a while since Ive posted here!

 

Alright, now that I got the coding down here is the cliffhanger spoiler...

Spoiler

Ben rolled his eyes. "A retreat, Dad? Really?" He shook his head. "I'm not buying it. If you think you can go after Vestara Khai without me-"

"I'm not," Luke interrupted. "I just need some time away."

Ben scowled, still doubtful. "And what about the Jedi?" He asked. "How do you expect the Order to get along without its Grand Master?"

Leia saw Luke's gaze flicker from Ben to Tahiri and Jiana, then to Ohali and herself - from the youngest generation to the eldest - and she felt the calm that came to him in the Force. The Jedi Order was strong and vigorous. The time had come for him to step out of the way, to let his creation grow into something larger than himself.

After a moment, Luke looked back to his son.

"Ben, I've been away for months now. You've read the same council reports I have. Did you see anything to suggest that the Order can't get along without me for a while?"

Ben furrowed his brow. "Well, no," he said. "But ... I still don't understand it. You aren't going all Yoda on me, are you?"

Luke chuckled. "Going Yoda?" he repeated. "Would that be so bad?"

it continues but I think you get the gist.

 

Interesting. Nonetheless, continue! Continue!

 

Well, like I said it's a cliffhanger so there really isn't much after what I said above...

Spoiler

Ben thought about that, then shrugged. "Only if you expect me to visit you in a swamp," he said. "Otherwise, I guess I'll deal with it."

Luke grinned and grasped his son's shoulders. "In that case, I'll be sure to avoid swamps. Now, how about we let Lando make the toast?"

Ben smiled and picked up his glass. "Sure thing." He turned to Lando. "Sorry to hold things up."

...there is about ten more lines to the epilogue and then its over. None of the lines have to deal with Luke's departure, just everyone smiling and laughing and such...

 

Hmmm interesting...possible set up for the movies, but also possible end to the EU as we know it? Sounds very final.

 

You know, wasn't one of the main conclusions of both DNT and FOTJ that the Jedi couldn't get along without Luke running everything? I mean, isn't that explicitly stated at the (Denning-penned) end of both series?

 

Indeed it was, but that was only because they weren't ready to make Jacen the protagonist and they had to have Luke back in the picture, at least in the case of Dark Nest. As for Fate of the Jedi, I don't think it was necessarily the intent on the part of the writers, it was just a byproduct of their plot.

 

Those contradictions are Denning's house of cards of retcons.

 

Dr. Steve Brule: You know, wasn't one of the main conclusions of both DNT and FOTJ that the Jedi couldn't get along without Luke running everything? I mean, isn't that explicitly stated at the (Denning-penned) end of both series?

Pretty much. Didn't Luke also return from the land of the living at the end of Apocalypse because Mara said that he was still needed? That if Krayt and the Sith were all out there (not to mention Abeloth), that Luke needed to be out there helping to protect the galaxy from them? Luke was ready to let go and join Mara in the Force, but didn't because his work was unfinished. So, this ending makes very, very little sense.

Plus, Yoda never retired. He was forced into hiding, but he didn't quit. And now what will Luke do?

 

Wander the galaxy. And while he's out there, somehow, through complicated Denning-plot, he will encounter either Vestara, Darth Krayt, or both.

Also, I wonder if this means he won't be appearing in the SOTJ trilogy (assuming it isn't cancelled)!

 

Unless he intends to take the fight to Krayt or something but fails in the process.

 

It's funny you say "retire". In the epilogue it is also discussed that...

Spoiler

Han and Leia would retire, too.

Spoiler

"Well, retire might be overstating it," she said. "But we're definitely taking a leave."

...says Leia...it would appear Denning is setting the stage for an out with the old in with the new future EU.

 

TUF came out 10 years ago this November. Man I feel old.
And how far after that are we IU? 15 years or so but with 5-6 or so of that covered by 06 to present?
We could so be still within 10 years of TUF IU if we did standalones, duologies and trilogies for an entire year IU I bet.

 

I just don't want to hear, somehow, that Saba stepped up and became Grand Master after this. Regardless, even with this, my EU has a huge gap between NJO and Legacy. Don't really see that changing.

 

Whats with the Mortis thing?

 

Spoiler

It is supposed to be the gate to the Force planet featured in the Clone Wars episode that gave birth to the FotJ series. But even that isn't made clear in the book.

 

Is the Dagger of Mortis mentioned? I'm unclear on if they actually go to Mortis or not. If so, the whole ten Knights business becomes a wasted plot. (This is ignoring that Mortis never should have been made literal.)

 

What else is new?

 

Spoiler

The story presented in the book has the villain's base set on the surface of the Mortis gate. Near the end of the book the final battle takes place inside the Mortis realm, but after the battle is won Luke contemplates that this Mortis may not be THEE Mortis and that dozens perhaps hundreds of Mortis gates are spread throughout the galaxy.

And I don't remember any mention of the Mortis dagger.

 

Not much. It just was actually one of the few things FOTJ set up that seemed interesting. Almost Arthurian. Knights on a quest to find the galactic holy grail. Depending on exactly what this book is supposed to do for the EU (ie. end "this" one, set it up for Disney's, etc.), that just seemed like a good plot thread. If the Big Three is truly taking something of a back seat, then we can have a very fresh EU again.

EDIT: Thanks Shane. That seems...odd.

 

Well how many plot lines since the end of TUF have been forgotten? Many for TUF, not sure for DNT (maybe 1 or 2 off the top of my head), multiple for LOTF with several per book it seems, a couple for FOTJ? Not surprising that it might get the shaft. Hope it doesn't because it does sound interesting but with Denning not wrapping things up I'm not holding my breath we will see this through.

 

Um... that isn't a cliffhanger.

That's a conclusion.

And it's something that the preview for Crucible said this book would contain.

Well, when they first announced SotJ, the major point of it was that the Big Three wouldn't be playing a big role (if any).

 

Thanks for all the posts SHANEamazon.