Full Series Ahsoka Tano: Jedi Knight

Tarkin is a control freak who believes in order and his own perverted view of justice. I second what you said, Jakobitis89. He wants the Jedi out of the way in order to increase his power. He thought that by finding a Jedi with a good reputation like Ahsoka that he would be also taking a large jab against the Jedi Order itself. He must have been really embarrassed to find out it was Barriss. I do think he must have suspected Ahsoka of killing Letta, since it was a secure facility, and he couldn't have imagined Barriss or anyone else doing it from a great distance, though he may have privately change his mind later. That's not exactly a mind I would like to fully understand.

 

Oh I don't think he went in knowing she was innocent. He simply didn't care either way. He wanted a chance to put the Jedi (as an order/concept) through a big flashy humiliating trial and seized the chance, that his little proxy/scapegoat happened to be young and lest we forget still pretty naïve and unable to comprehend/articulate exactly how rigged the system really was, well that just made it easier for him. The real fault lies with the Council playing politics over the trial and trying to play it in a
way they look best instead of saying 'to hell with public relations, we want the real truth' but they seemed a little too willing to sacrifice Ahsoka for the sake of their image, for me. Which is of course exactly what Tarkin wanted them to do, but they don't come out looking too respectable. Ahsoka has the excuse of her young age and political/judicial inexperience for her undeniable errors - unlike a council of you know, Jedi Masters. You don't get that title just because you are handy with a lightsaber... or perhaps now you do!

 

My thoughts exactly, and a point I've been trying to make for a while now but I never could find the proper way to put it in words. Thank you for doing it.

 

You two make some good points. There have been some who have made the case that Luke is a better Grand Master than Yoda. That is to say that Yoda is wiser, but Luke is a better military leader.

There definitely was a problem with Mace and Yoda making the decision to expel Ahsoka. It's clearly not something Obi-Wan or Plo wanted to do, and I think that Yoda, Mace, Ki-Adi, and the others out-voted them. I'm glad Yoda regretted it later.

 

The problem, IMO is that the Jedi of the Clone Wars aren't supposed to be military leaders. This is stated by both Qui-Gon ("I can only protect you, now fight a war for you"), Windu ("We are keepers of the peace, not soldiers") and Anakin ("We're not warriors, we're peace keepers"). That was one of the Council's biggest mistakes : they allowed themselves to go out of their way to protect the Republic and became warriors overnight after spending a millennium as peace-keepers. This would amount to a government ordering it's national police force to become soldiers and go on the front lines the next day. This was probably a major factor in Barriss' fall, she just was too compassionate a person, to righteous a Jedi to be used as an instrument of war.

I wouldn't say that Yoda made that decision. He went with the majority, which in this case was Saese Tinn, Ki Adi Mundi and Mace Windu. Filoni said himself that Obi-Wan and Plo Koon were on Ahsoka's side though. I believe Yoda's attitude is fitting of the role he gives himself as a Grand Master. Nevertheless, by keeping the lines between politicians and Jedi so blurry, by enabling his fellow Jedi to have such faulty reasonings and by not doubting their decision when Ahsoka looks him in the eye and claims her innocence, he's as responsible as the rest ; as is Obi-Wan who knows that this is all wrong but just watches it happen under his nose.

This brings us to what is, in my eyes, another major problem : what of the other Masters? When Tarkin makes the request to have Ahsoka expelled there are roughly ten masters present in the room. Why doesn't Yoda ask for their opinion and why don't they give it? We know from her reaction that Shaak Ti is shocked by Tarkin's request. What if a majority of Masters in the room agree with Obi-Wan's objection? Does it mean the opinion of the "old folks" is the only one that matters?
We have the exact same issue in RotS when the Council decides to send Obi-Wan after Grievous. There are at least 10 masters in the circle, but you only hear 4 of them agree on that, the others just stay silent. We can only assume that if they don't object they agree but still... Why did Lucas bother to come up with a Jedi Council of twenty seats if in the end you only see the same four-five ones make all the talk and decisions? All the others are as useless as potted trees. The only moment they ever come alive is when they all try to reach Qui-Gon through Yoda.

 

I am glad that in the 2D and 3D Clone Wars television series we heard more Jedi Council members talking besides Mace, Yoda, and Ki-Adi than in the prequels. But like you said, more should have been discussing these issues.

I'm that Tarkin really intimidated a lot of people.

 

Sorry. I meant to say, "I'm guessing that Tarkin really intimidated a lot of people." He seems to do that a lot. He technically sexually harassed Ahsoka and Leia.

 

What ?

 

He grabbed their chins.

http://cdnvideo.dolimg.com/cdn_assets/ceebe7c691e89e30f009645362af6e5a06bebe3b.jpg

 

With Tano there was sexual innuendo involved by the way he caressed her face and squeezed her lips, and she was a teen . There he was supposed to be this symbol of authority of the Republic which was supposed to all good and who the Jedi have to answer to and all of that kinda thing. Meanwhile Tarkin is a sadistic, a perv and creep, a human version of Jabba while combined with Dooku. And the look and reaction Tano gives in revulsion and retaliaion is telling & suburb.

 

I agree. Considering her age, it is disturbing. I took it as speciesist and sexist on his part.

 

I agree with Anakinfan (can you believe it?) on this. If you think that's disturbing then what to say of the way Honda grabbed her chin, stroke her lip and said he was going to turn her into profit?

 

Like that guy in the bar, whom Ventress stabbed?

 

Would the difference with the Tarkin and Hondo scenes, be that, while they are Touching, it is not the same kind - their reasons are purely "intimidation"?

 

Well Ventress walked into a cantina known for being a wretched hive for scum and villainy. Plus she was armed and not dressed like a princess . The alien was drunk hitting on her and not taking her version of no for an answer(she said get lost as in picking a ), but nothing he did up to that point justified her killing him in such a cold blooded manner - she couldve knocked him out or broke his arm. She's still a darksider and a murderer even there, which is cool as far as her character wise, but I don't think one can claim she was legally or morally right.

 

You forget the place she walked into, where she is and what she is, and that she was armed as I said. Long story short, I think you're just looking for trivial ways to be justifying her murdering the drunk bounty hunter cause you like her, while with Tano you're downplaying Tarkin's more sinister less said approach cause you make it a constant point you do not like the character.

 

As much as I believe that anakinfan's opinion on Ahsoka is more than negatively biased, I doubt it has anything to do with his opinion on this matter. The fact is I like Ahsoka but on this point I completely agree with him : Tarkin was being a condescending ass to her, not sexually harassing her. Grabbing someone's shin doesn't qualify as sexual harassment. Last I checked the chin isn't an erogenous zone, not even for togrutas. I wouldn't even qualify Bo Katan's butt-slap as sexual harassment, just a little provocation.

As for Ventress, I think her murdering the guy who was soliciting her in Mos Eisly was just in character for at this point of her life. She was still the "mess with me and you're dead" kind of person.

 

My bad. As long as she isn't a changeling...