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Discussion in 'Community' started by epic , Sep 15, 2020.

  1. epic

    epic Ex Mod star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 4, 1999
    this blew up awhile back because of the Netflix poster but seems people are now reacting to the actual movie itself, criticising it in particular for some sexualised dance scenes whilst seemingly ignoring the fact the premise of the movie is itself an attack on the pornification of girls and young women in society, and that the sexualised dancing is meant to be challenging for the viewer. critics would argue the artistic intent is irrelevant and 11 year olds twerking on camera is problematic, end of story. what say you jcc?
     
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  2. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk Community Moderator star 6 Staff Member Moderator

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    If I google this, will I end up on a register?
     
  3. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

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    Sep 27, 2000
    I haven't seen it but yeah, I had read the director's intent was to criticize this. Of course no one seems to have told Netflix's marketing department.
     
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  4. SithLordDarthRichie

    SithLordDarthRichie CR Emeritus: London star 9

    Registered:
    Oct 3, 2003
    I've not watched it, but most reviews I've seen say it is very critical of the subject matter.

    I would argue making people uncomfortable is what it's supposed to do.
    Yes young girls dancing provocatively is wrong, that's the point.

    This is hardly new, look at the sort of song lyrics & music videos kids have been exposed to from pop stars for decades.
    It gives them the wrong impression from a young age.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
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  5. Princess_Tina

    Princess_Tina Wacky Wednesday Winner star 7 VIP - Game Winner

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    May 10, 2001
  6. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk Community Moderator star 6 Staff Member Moderator

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    Nov 25, 2013
    There goes the Bible Belt
     
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  7. a star war

    a star war JCC Basketball Draft Host star 4 VIP - Game Host

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    May 4, 2016
    I don’t think that is the point. I think you’ve missed the point entirely, putting it on the girls.
     
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  8. SithLordDarthRichie

    SithLordDarthRichie CR Emeritus: London star 9

    Registered:
    Oct 3, 2003
    Kids are influenced by the environment around them, which is controlled by adults.

    None of the behaviour is on them, they're encouraged to do it.
    And that's wrong, which I understand is the point the movie tries to make.

    How well it does that I wouldn't know
     
  9. 3sm1r

    3sm1r Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2017
    AFAIR it was criticized because the kids were sexualized in the poster, and once they changed it the problem was solved.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  10. SithLordDarthRichie

    SithLordDarthRichie CR Emeritus: London star 9

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    Oct 3, 2003
    Netflix certainly dropped the ball with how they marketed the movie
     
  11. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 6

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    Oct 4, 1998
    I have a policy that I don't criticize movies I haven't seen, books I haven't read, and TV shows I don't watch. That said, my inner cynic is suggesting that the film makers are trying to have it both ways, making a movie that appeals to the pervs and claiming that their goal is to shine light on the problem. Which is my take on Suckerpunch (yes, I did see that one).
     
  12. Princess_Tina

    Princess_Tina Wacky Wednesday Winner star 7 VIP - Game Winner

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    May 10, 2001
    It's a French film helmed by a French-Senegalese director who based her screenplay on her own experiences as a refugee girl in France.
    According to Wikipedia, Doucouré spent nearly 18 months researching studies on how young and pre-teen children are being exposed to 18+ adult content and sexualised images on social media in order to showcase the accurate reality in the film. She says that the film deals with self image and social media. “Our girls see that the more a woman is overly sexualized on social media, the more she’s successful. And the children just imitate what they see, trying to achieve the same result without understanding the meaning, and yeah, it’s dangerous.”

    It really does seem like the kind of project a female director would make based on her genuine concern for young girls, imho.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
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  13. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

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    Aug 16, 2002
    This is a perfect movie for Republicans to rile up the QAnon types.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  14. Kenneth Morgan

    Kenneth Morgan Chosen One star 4

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    May 27, 1999
    Sarge likes this.
  15. Lowbacca_1977

    Lowbacca_1977 Jedi Grand Master star 6

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    Jun 28, 2006
    I find that criticism to be right up there with saying how a movie criticising racism shouldn't depict any racism in it.
     
  16. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk Community Moderator star 6 Staff Member Moderator

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    Nov 25, 2013
    From the article:

    "I thought about just making a documentary where I didn't actually murder puppies to make the point, but it just wasn't powerful enough," said director Amélie Le'Charpentier (who is, by the way, a woman of color and an immigrant, so think about that before you criticize her).
     
  17. tom

    tom Chosen One star 7

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    Mar 14, 2004
    haha wow cool website
     
  18. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

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    Aug 16, 2002
    It's a right-wing Onion! That is, it's not funny.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  19. Princess_Tina

    Princess_Tina Wacky Wednesday Winner star 7 VIP - Game Winner

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    May 10, 2001
    Not funny in the least.
     
  20. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 6

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    Dec 19, 2015
    Should a work of commercial art be judged by its creator's intent or by the kind of audience it attracts? You have five minutes to pick a side. Choose wisely.
     
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  21. Adam of Nuchtern

    Adam of Nuchtern Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Hashem save me from people too stupid to realize that depiction does not equal endorsement.

    Edit: somehow forgot to include "not".
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  22. a star war

    a star war JCC Basketball Draft Host star 4 VIP - Game Host

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    May 4, 2016
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  23. Rogue1-and-a-half

    Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Nov 2, 2000
    One problem is that you can depict racism in a fictional movie by having people pretend to be racist. If you're depicting pre-teen girls behaving sexually, well, that is what it is. Yes, there's backstory and they're actresses and this is a fictional movie. But it's still what it is which is a pre-teen being sexualized. Like White God made me extremely uncomfortable with its depictions of animal cruelty; no animal cruelty was actually perpetrated by the filmmakers. (I mean, theoretically).

    I honestly don't know how I feel about this film because I think the sexualization of young children is a very particular issue because, as I state above, you can't exactly "depict" it without, by its very nature, just "doing" it. And there are obviously legal connotations. The director has talked about using doubles and composite shots to some degree, so that should be part of the discussion. But I do think this is a particularly thorny issue, even as these kinds of issues go. I tend to just be the guy who is on the side of the artist, but this, I think, is more complicated than the majority of these kinds of questions are.

    That said, of course, I always default to the position that, while I can be aware of the issues surrounding a work of art and even discuss them, I will not give a strong opinion on a work of art without experiencing it. And I don't think I'll be watching this, so I suppose that's about all I have to say on the matter.
     
  24. a star war

    a star war JCC Basketball Draft Host star 4 VIP - Game Host

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    May 4, 2016
    A movie about the horrors of war doesn't actually have people going to war, and yet a pro-war audience can take away the wrong message. Full Metal Jacket is a favorite of Marines, in my experience, for example.

    Even if no one is being hurt it can go wrong. This in particular is just unfortunate, despite authorial intent.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
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  25. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    Yeah I was gonna say, in this case these young girls still had to actually dance sexually, so that could be seen as problematic for the actors.
     
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