main
side
curve
  1. Welcome to the new boards! Details here!

Amph HBO's Watchmen

Discussion in 'Community' started by Adam of Nuchtern, May 8, 2019.

  1. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    Yeah there is no way he was Dan..that doesn't make sense. My guess is with Dan in custody per the extra materials that they gave his ship to the police.

    Also, the kids are her former partner's kids. The oldest kid is the one she mentioned.
     
  2. Blame_It_On_Lucas

    Blame_It_On_Lucas Jedi Master star 1

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2004
    I am loving what we've gotten so far from Watchmen. I've been thinking about each episode even days after I seen them.

    So question. How much stock are we putting in on the speculation that Will was the true Hooded Justice back in the Minute Men days?
     
    Mortimer Snerd likes this.
  3. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    I love the continued mystery of Hooded Justice.

    If they do this character (Hooded) justice, his true identity will remain a mystery.
     
    BigAl6ft6 and Blame_It_On_Lucas like this.
  4. PymParticles

    PymParticles Marquis de Nouveaux Films star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2014
    Another really great, really weird episode:

    I was completely wrong about Jeremy Irons playing Ozymandias; he's definitely Adrian (that shot of him in the costume was both sad and hilarious and very, very cool), but now the question remains as to who the Game Master is? Everything with Adrian here was great, the man is an absolute lunatic, and you can see bite marks on the edges of the screen from all the scenery Irons is chewing. I loved Laurie in this episode. Everything about her demeanor showing attributes from her father, he deciding to take on this case to potentially gain a presidential pardon for Dan, to her conversation with Doctor Manhattan (I love that humanity has built phone booths to send "prayers" to this distant, detached god on Mars) to her sexual hangups related to her past life, which is very reminiscent of Dan in the original comic. Her conversation with Angela was great, particularly Angela's completely nonplussed reaction to Laurie's vague threat.

    Lastly, despite being wrong about Irons/Veidt, I do fully believe Will is Hooded Justice. I now present my evidence:
    1. He's the right age.
    2. He would have been influenced by the contrast between the movie he was watching at the start (based on actual, real life figure Bass Reeves) with its statement of "There will be no mob justice today. Trust in the law!" juxtaposed against what was actually happening around him at the time in Tulsa.
    3. Will appropriating and reclaiming the imagery of the hangman's noose as a symbol of his own personal power and dispersement of justice, given the prevalence of lynching at the time, would be thematically fitting and actually give a meaningful reason for that element of Hooded Justice's design.
    4. That further ties in with Judd being hanged/lynched at the end of the first episode.
    5. There's the visual connection that Will is wearing a purple undercoat with a red jacket, which matches Hooded Justice's costume of a purple bodysuit and red cape.
    6. Superheroes are as American an invention as jazz and rock 'n roll, and like those music genres this puts the concept's creation (as a real thing within the world of the series) firmly in the hands of black Americans, with a connection to a real life figure in Bass Reeves to boot. This makes the portrayal of Hooded Justice in American Hero Story as an angry white man with an identity crisis who's upset at society for vague reasons al the more ironic, because of course people would assume he was white without even knowing what he looks like under his costume. The same scenario played out with Bass Reeves in the film Will was watching at the start of the show, only with an unmasking to dispel any false notions.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  5. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2002
    Just watched episodes 2 and 3
    Love that they showed us the White Night. Still not sure what exactly Judd did. Sure the Klan robe looks like it is his-- could also be his father (remember the photo they've shown us twice now). Unclear if his wife has anything to do with it- or Senator Keane. He's clearly up to something as well.

    Sister Night is by far my favorite character so far and that costume is amazing. Red Scare brings up a good point though- with Judd dead, who is in charge? I almost got the impression it was Angela.

    Angela being Will's granddaughter was something I did not see coming. If he is the original Hooded Justice, this may be something like a Nite Owl situation. The original Hooded Justice was not part of the Minutemen- either a copycat or someone sanctioned by Will was. As to who took him away at the end- I could not even begin to guess.

    Laurie was excellent. Jean Smart stated she had not completed reading the comic by the time shooting started, but she had since read it and was clear that she had a take on this character but it wasn't defined by the comic. I think she did an amazing job. I do find it curious how quickly she identified all the masks but not really that surprising given her experience and what she does. Her joke to John was pretty amusing- as was his response with a 'brick' of his own. The case containing a giant blue sextoy was quite a surprise and Petey got to live out his fantasy. The reveal that Dan may be let out if Kean wins the presidency is interesting. Given all the liberal talk of Redford's presidency, I would have expected a pardon for Dan at some point.

    Glad they finally ended the 'mystery' over Irons being Adrian. It was clear of course and the costume at the end was great. Very clear we are going by the comic and not the movie now. Intrigued by the identity of the Game Master. My guess is Lady Tru (who we have yet to meet but those of us at NYCC saw clip of her) is behind his 'imprisonment' and the Game Master works for her.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2019
    Sith_Sensei__Prime likes this.
  6. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Veidt's property/compound is really starting to interest me...his expendable servant-clones, his seemingly old-timey steampunk experiments...a letter war with one appointed in the role of game warden...so many questions.

    I thought the giant blue Dr. Manhattan vibrator was a bit over the top but I still laughed.

    Did I miss something though? When Will was hoisted away in the car by the magnet...whatever happened to him?
     
  7. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    I love that the episode title was a Devo deep cut.
     
    Mortimer Snerd likes this.
  8. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    And a delightfully hilarious double entendre.
     
    blackmyron likes this.
  9. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    Laurie was straight up repeating Rorschach's "Roll on snare drum" line so I guess she probably read Rorschach's journal at some point. (which looks like it was actually published but more of a curiosity). Her shooting the not-Batman (The Revenger?) may be a bit that since he looks kind of like Nite Owl she was taking out aggression him. So where has the show mentioned that Dan is in prison? Apparently it's in the supplementary materiel I haven't gotten around to that one yet.

    Someone mentioned that in episode 1 Doctor Manhattan's Mars Sand Castle looked like the compound Adrian is staying it, could Doc be The Gamemaster and he's keeping Adrian in prison? Just seems odd like I don't think Doc would actually care what Adrian is up to enough to confine him.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
    Mortimer Snerd likes this.
  10. Jedi Daniel

    Jedi Daniel Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2000
    That was the best episode yet. Jean Smart was perfect in the role. I'm really hoping the OST is released too, love the music :)
     
    DAR likes this.
  11. Jedi Daniel

    Jedi Daniel Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2000
    This is my theory too
     
    Mortimer Snerd and Yodaminch like this.
  12. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    slowly digging through the supplementary materiel which did point out what I thought could have been a continuity glitch, that Rorschach's journal was unreadable when he was first arrested but the journal he dropped off at the New Fronistersman could have also been illegible but since it was printed, and the file reminds me that Rorschach called it a "final draft", and seeing the pages in this most recent episode, he probably decided to print legibly this time. It could have always been possible that even though his journal exposed Adrian's conspiracy (mostly) that nobody would be able to understand it anyway, another dark joke, but it seems he made sure people could read the "final draft".
     
  13. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Doc's Martian "sand castle" looked exactly like the castle Adrian is in...as did the floating "tinker toy" contraption that Topher was building when Angela had her talk with him about Judd.

    I'm dying to see what's up with the servants.
     
    BigAl6ft6, Jedi Daniel and Yodaminch like this.
  14. Leoluca Randisi

    Leoluca Randisi Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 24, 2014
    I love this show its super hero DC comics but its not. Its almost a drama about race relations. it really makes you think about things!
     
    Jedi Daniel likes this.
  15. nilzo antonio

    nilzo antonio Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 31, 2015
    Maybe Doc's Castle is indeed Adrian's. Meaning Veidt is being held by DM in Mars as punishment for his acts. The whole space suit is just Veidt trying to figure out a way to come back to earth.
     
  16. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    That honestly never occurred to me and now I can't see it any other way.
     
    BigAl6ft6 and solojones like this.
  17. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    That makes perfect sense! I bet he is indeed trying to get out of his Mars prison. That would make sense.

    So I haven't read the supplementary material but I still got that Dan is in prison. Because someone mentioned to Laurie that 'her owl' is in prison, right? And that they could try to get him out? I sincerely hope we get to see Dan at some point, and I really hope the casting is awesome.

    This episode was great. And thank God they didn't draw out the 'who is Jeremy Irons playing' thing for too much longer, since it was so obvious.
     
    Jedi Daniel and Mortimer Snerd like this.
  18. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    I just listened to the podcast and when Craig Mazin asks Lindelof why Veidt has created these servants, Lindelof interrupts him with "What makes you think he created them?" and that cemented that theory down pretty solidly for me.

    I love where this is going.

    Edit: That said, I'm pleased you enjoyed the tomatoes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2019
  19. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2002
    If that is the case,
    really makes you wonder how John feels about Adrian murdering his creations over and over again.
     
    BigAl6ft6 likes this.
  20. Bilbo Fett

    Bilbo Fett Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 19, 2017
    You can only see it when he's shown from the back, but he's also wearing a hoodie underneath all of that.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2019
  21. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    They have the same number of particles whether they're living or dead. He doesn't care.
     
  22. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    Yeah, they're all going to hell anyways.
     
    BigAl6ft6 likes this.
  23. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2002
    But see, the whole end was that Laurie gets him to care. And then he decides he is going to go create life of his own- essentially be god. So how does god feel about people killing his children? Seems like he doesn’t care for now. But who knows...
     
  24. JEDI-SOLO

    JEDI-SOLO Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 12, 2002
    See I’m kinda confused on just how Ep 3 ended.
    most likely that was Dr M saying hi to Silk. On the other hand I can’t help but wonder if that was Granpa Wheels saying “step off Sister!” Since he went up in the air at the end of Ep 2.
     
    BigAl6ft6 likes this.
  25. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    yah I am a mite curious if the car in the end of episode 3 is the same car in the end of episode 2, do we see Laurie drive to the Doc Manhattan booth earlier in the episode then that is her car that lands? Did Doc smash Angela's car that the wheelchair guy left in. I think it's supposed to be a message from Doc if only it matches the "brick" punchline that Julie told (and we see Mars flare at her afterwards) so maybe he smashed her car.

    Interesting notion that this is the one time God actually answers a person's prayers quite directly. I can see Doc Manhattan being used kind of like how Jacob was on Lost, lots of people talking about him but only see him like twice. I do think it's likely we'll get a Doctor Manhattan narration flashback/flashforward episode like his great issue of Watchmen
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2019