Full Series Official "The Clone Wars" Series Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Re: Rancisis, he would be very difficult to animate with the beard and serpentine body, so I don't blame them for not showing him so far OOU. IU upon his appearance (S6) I think we should get a reference such as "Master Rancisis has recently returned from coordinating the Outer Rim Sieges on Eriadu" to explain his absence.

 

-shrugs-

They're clones, not real babies.

 

Their clones of a human being. They eat,sleep, bleed , and in one case had children with an alien. Them are some pretty real babies to me Mr.Stalin.

 

You're weird.

 

RG4

If you are talking about Jek and his sister, they arent Cuts real children. I think clones are sterilized. Otherwise it would be a huge catastrophy for the galaxy to spread jango fetts DNA a 10 million times..

 

RE: Clones, that's what I don't like Umbara. The clones aren't normal people, they were specifically bred to be organic droids to fight in a war. And when you're breeding an army, there are certain characteristics you will want expressed, and others you won't. They need to be at the peak of physical ability, they need to be disciplined, they need to be able to cope with seeing death all around them. What you don't want is for your soldiers to be able to question what they're doing, because that defeats the entire point of the clones. The ultimate goal is to use them against the Jedi they serve under. If they get too compassionate, or too attached to their leaders, then your plans to eliminate the Jedi is thrown into jeopardy. With the case of Umbara, we have a seemingly headstrong and callous leader like Krell who doesn't think twice about sending his armies to certain death so long as it ultimately achieves victory. While this may be unorthodox for a Jedi General, the clones should not be openly objecting to such orders, as if they can think that freely about what they've been ordered to do then how the hell are they going to cope with being given an even more difficult order to fulfill, like once Sidious initiates Order 66? If I was hiring an army to do what the clones are meant to do, I'd want a guarantee that when the time comes they will follow any order I give them, no hesitation. If they're going to be this outspoken then I would not rest my entire plans on this army when it's a 50/50 gamble whether they'll be reliable or not. If you look at how Order 66 plays out in ROTS, the message is very clear that these guys are nothing but pawns, and no matter what order is given, they will carry it out. One minute they're flying alongside their Jedi General, the next they're shooting them out of the sky. That's not something an ordinary person would be able to do.

Now obviously, Krell turns out to be a traitor, which one could argue does foreshadow Order 66 and the clones' ability to arrest enemies to the Republic, even if they're Jedi and giving them commands. But this story is set while the Jedi are still seen as beacons of light and championing good in the galaxy. Krell runs very much against what the rest of the Jedi are doing, and the clones' animosity and resentment towards him happens almost from the first time they meet. So by the time Carnage of Krell comes around, there's already a solid base for these guys to want to take him down and bring him to justice. And even then they're very hesitant and it's not until it becomes blatant that he's trying to undermine the campaign that they decide to take action. So it's a very different case to Order 66, which as I've said is not something that's shown to be based on a gradual progression of distrust and animosity between the clones and their Jedi leaders. At least on screen. It's very much at the snap of a finger, they open fire on the Jedi. In the case of Ki-Adi Mundi, they're in the middle of a bloody charge against the droids when the Order is given, and they stop just like that to gun him down. And it's not like the Jedi in ROTS are in any way asking their men to do morally ambiguous things - the very opposite in fact, it's Order 66 that most resembles what Krell's trying to do.

I think TCW humanizes the clones too much, especially in Umbara. They told an okay story about questioning what are obviously treacherous orders and doing what is right, but that isn't appropriate to tell with clones as they should not be capable of doing that. Clones aren't people. I object to how they're portrayed in TCW.

 

Before TCW the clones were a faceless mass. With TCW we saw so much individualism in them, its just overstretched. That clone with blonde long hair was the funiest.

 

Don't be hating on the Clones, they rule!!!

 

As they should be.

No, the Tunnel Snakes rule.

 

Which one was that?

 

The clones are still humans right? IRL humans are the most adaptable creatures on the planet. The only creature capable of changing to meet the demands of the surrounding environment at will and even able to change the surrounding environment at will to suit him. What makes humans special is their intelligence but really underneath it he is driven by the same basic instinct to survive, breed, and eat which for a human actually mean predation. You can suppress alot of those basic instincts and even the aggression which in itself sounds ludicrous to me, on earth that'd suppressing 200,000 years (5 million if you whanna go back to the earliest ancestors) worth of genetics. I'm not sure how long humans have existed in the GFFA. However I don't believe you can take away the inherent adaptability which isn't really a genetic trait at all but a convergent trait.

Maybe if clones worked in Walmart their entire lives sweeping the floors I could understand them staying docile exactly like the Kaminoan sales pitch but the hard experience of war is going to bring out and express their ingrained humanity. The war is going to be a personal experience for each. Some like Gregor fit the mold and others like Rex and Fives break out of it with their experiences. In TCW the clones really seem to still have all their regular instincts. Fear of death, fight or flight, sexual desires, prey drive, and they even still seem to have some parental instincts deep in there somewhere so those are all still present and do surface in the clones.

That was Crys. "The Deserter"

 

"I hesitated for a moment when I received Order 66 because the last thing I expected was a Jedi coup. Did I feel betrayed? You bet I did. I thought of all my men who died under Ki-Adi-Mundi's command, and if I'd known then that he and his buddies were gearing up to do the Separatists' work for them and overthrow the government, I'd have shot him as a traitor a lot earlier. He betrayed the trust of every one of us." ―Commander Bacara

Part of the tragedy of the Sith's revenge and Palpatine's rise is the concept of betrayal. While Palpatine smiles and feigns affection for the Republic, Darth Sidious betrays them to the Confederacy. With but a few words from Palpatine, the people betray their Jedi protectors, and betray the principles of the Republic in the name of a new Empire. And with poisoned coaxing, Anakin betrays the Jedi Order for the Sith to save his love. The strength of the Sith was the ability to turn friend against foe, to induce willing betrayal in order to topple the established order.

The clones become part of that tragedy. While the clones betray the Jedi at the issuance of Order 66, it's because they have been deceived―betrayed even, one might say―by Palpatine, to believe that the true treachery has been committed by the Jedi. The clones turning on their Jedi allies becomes all the more poignant when you realize that they've been taken in by a lie given as law. The very people who had looked out for them so often during the war, saving their lives time and again, and on the whole striving to lift them up when much of the Republic spat on them. They've been poisoned against their only outside friends, manipulated by Palpatine as so many others have been, completing another tower of betrayal because they believed that all of that friendship had been a lie and the Jedi were truly out to rule or destroy the Republic for themselves. And under the Empire, when there are no Jedi officers who care for their interests, they suffer for it, completing the tragedy.

They're not sterile. We've got multiple instances of clones having children in canon, from Venku Skirata and Connor Freeman, to Boba Fett's own daughter, Ailyn Vel.

The clones have been humanized for years, from The Cestus Deception to Republic Commando and Dark Lord: Rise of Darth Vader. Everything TCW has done in the area of clones has been built on the back of what's already been established.

 

Yes, and I disagree with that, I don't think that stuff makes sense for what the clones are made for.

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Crys

 

He died his hair, he had to match it with his armour! In war, fashion is of the utmost importance.

 

The author? Really she posted here at one point?

 

Yup...

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/...l-triple-zero.20170225/page-124#post-21662495

 

Interesting.

 

Another instance where the Clone Wars is adding to the story we thought we knew...

What we are seeing in the current arc is the continuing sway of the Clones against what they thought were their leaders and shining beacons of light, the Jedi. Krell first, and now Ahsoka, are Jedi who - they think - are taking the lives of Clones for their own reasons. You can tell Cmdr Fox especially is starting to show his growing ire at the situation with Clones lives being taken.

This is likely leading to a political situation where the Clones align themselves with the military more so than the Jedi due to the issues that have occurred. Palpatine may institute Order 66 as a way to quickly cut off a Jedi Rebellion, and this is likely kept a secret from the Jedi. The Clones would be more likely to keep this secret since their trust is now shaken. By the time of Revenge of the Sith, the status quo of Jedi leading Clones into battle is a mere formality. They would already be ready to take them out if the order comes down.

 

Yep. There are several authors that post here, and more that have in the past. Jason Fry and JJ Miller are around a good bit, for instance, and you can usually catch John Ostrander, Jan Durseema, and Randy Stradley in comics threads. They're quite personable, too, should you ever be inclined to give them a shout.

Order 66 wasn't secret, it was one of 150 contingency orders known to everyone in the Grand Army, including the Jedi. The genius of Order 66 was that it stood side by side with orders to remove the Chancellor if necessary, and further possible military scenarios such as dealing with shutting down the Republic banking system in the event of a enemy breach, or defending Coruscant if it should come under attack. The Jedi never expected their Generals to go rogue―which in truth, of course, they didn't―so no one considered it a legitimate concern and dismissed it as bureaucratic ass-covering.

 

Meh.. Even the name Crys. Sounds like a boy-band member..

Lux, Crys, Korkie and Saw...

 

Leader singer Obi.

 

Crys would probably be a cool clone to explore. He is either the ultimate cheerleader or a really individualistic clone mismatched to his group.