*OFFICIAL THREAD* RotS Discrepancies, Gaping Plot Holes and Continuity Problems

" This is what Yoda says to Obi-wan.

YODA: "Master Kenobi, wait a moment. In your solitude on Tatooine, training I have for you."

OBI-WAN: "Training??"

YODA: "An old friend has learned the path to immortality."

OBI-WAN: "Who?"

YODA: "One who has returned from the netherworld of the Force to train me . . . your old Master, Qui-Gon Jinn."

OBI-WAN: "Qui-Gon? But, how could he accomplish this?"

YODA: "The secret of the Ancient Order of the Whills, he studied. How to commune with him. I will teach you."

OBI-WAN: "I will be able to talk with him?"

YODA: "How to join the Force, he will train you. Your consciousness you will retain, when one with the Force. Even your physical self, perhaps."


Not sure how much of that is retained, but that's what's in the film. "

Hmm, one of the people who was answering questions cuz he just saw the movie was saying that there's no mention of Qui Gon...

 

Hmm, one of the people who was answering questions cuz he just saw the movie was saying that there's no mention of Qui Gon...

NO NO NO NO NO!!!!

What those of us who've seen the movie have said is that you don't see Qui-Gon and you don't hear his voice. Yoda still tells Obi-Wan about him, though.

 

From what I understand of the movie, every time Palpatine says "Order 66" the clones say "Yes sir", then immediately turn around and kill the Jedi closest to them. This happens like five or six times.

This seems pretty clear to me.

I suppose it would have been clearer if the dialogue was

Palpatine: "Carry out Order 66"
Clone 1: "Order 66 - Kill the Jedi, right?"
Palpatine: "Yes"
Clone 1: "Wow, we learned about Order 66 on Kamino so many years ago, and now we are finally carrying it out, huh?"
Palpatine: "Um, yes"
Clone 1: "OK I'm going to kill the Jedi now...you know - Order 66"
Palpatine: "Yes very good"


Next scene.

Palpatine: "Carry out Order 66"
Clone 2: "Order 66 - Kill the Jedi, right?"
Palpatine (sighs): "Yes"
Clone 2: "Wow, we learned about Order 66 on Kamino so many years ago, and now we are finally carrying it out, huh?"
Palpatine: "Yes, yes"
Clone 2: "OK I'm going to kill the Jedi now...you know - Order 66"
Palpatine: "Yes please do it now, thanks!"

Next scene.

Palpatine: "Carry out Order 66"
Clone 3: "Order 66 - Kill the Jedi, right?"
Palpatine: "DOH!"

 

Prime example not everything needs to be spoonfed to the audience.

 

1: in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to.

He says, "I don't seem to remember ever owning a droid." First of all, he never did own a droid. Even R4 didn't belong to him. The Jedi are all commies! No, but seriously... He's telling a half truth. Come on,man.

2: in ROTS, only C3P0's memory is wiped. R2's is not. So at any time from that point until ANH, R2, as C3PO's constantly bickering counterpoint, could come back with, "at least I wasn't built by Darth Vader!" as a comeback to any quip from C3PO. The point I'm really making is that it's hard to believe ,since C3PO and R2 are best buds for approx. 20 years before ANH, that R2D2 didn't reveal at least once, C3PO's origin, especially considering how much they bicker. And if it was revealed to C3P0, how come he didn't say to Luke when he first met him, "Skywalker. I've heard that name before. R2, where did I hear that name? Oh that's right! Your father."

Don't you think R2 might be in on the whole thing? He was there when the twins were born and given specific instructions. Why would he tell 3PO? All he does is @#$% things up. There's a reason Bail wiped one droid and not the other, and R2 is surely aware of this, what being next to 3PO when the command was given (if you look at the script).

3: This is the one that bugs me the most. The jedi who commissioned the clones is only mentioned in AOTC, but we never see him. To me, this is forshadowing for something to happen in the next film. Yet, it doesn't. This guy isn't even mentioned in ROTS. I, for one, would have liked to know more about him and what caused him to commission the clones in the first place. Now, I do not read any of the novels or comics, nor should a fan or movie-goer be required to do so, just to understand the series as a whole. Every plot point should be satisifed by the end of a story, otherwise it's incomplete.

Point taken. I think most viewers will just assume that Dooku ordered the clones (and I KNOW that's not what it says in LoE, but no common movie fan gives a @$%#) since he hired Jango used to be a Jedi, hence he was capable of erasing Kamino from the archives.

4: What is Uncle Owen's story? Why was this Owen guy chosen to raise Luke.? They say he's Luke's family. In what way is he related? According to back-story i read somwhere, he's Obi-wan's brother. That's not clearly shown in the movie. Is he related to Shmi? It would be nice to know.

Well I paid attention during Attack of the Clones, which explained that Anakin's mother, Shmi, married a moisture farmer named Cliegg Lars. His son, Owen Lars, married Beru Whitesun. Anakin and Owen are stepbrothers and Owen is Luke's stepuncle. "Uncle" Owen.

5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB.

First of all, it is CLEARLY ESTABLISHED in A New Hope that Anakin Skywalker is from Tatooine.

Obi-Wan: Your uncle thought he should have stayed here, not gotten involved.

Anakin was a slave on Tatooine, and then his mother died there. It's also on the outer rim and contains nothing of interest to either the Empire or the Republic. Vader has NO REASON to return there.

Finally, having assumed his child to be dead, he wouldn't go looking for him PERIOD. Hence, it would make even less sense for him to search for him in a specific place, say Tatooine?

[

 

" First of all, it is CLEARLY ESTABLISHED in A New Hope that Anakin Skywalker is from Tatooine."

Well if you want to get technical, in the first draft of the screenplay Tatooine is called Utapau.

 

Biggest hole is still the "Leia memory" thing from ROTJ. Its a huge one in my book. It has never been rectified and ROTS doesnt make it any clearer.

 

Biggest hole is still the "Leia memory" thing from ROTJ. Its a huge one in my book. It has never been rectified and ROTS doesnt make it any clearer.

You only need to use your imagination:

1. Leia said she remembered "images, feelings"
2. Leia grew up as the adopted daughter of Sen. Organa.
3. Sen. Organa probably had holorecordings of Padme that she could show little Leia.
4. Leia grew up watching some of the holorecordings, thus she remembers the images and feelings of watching them.

There - no plot hole.

 

6: Was Anakin really immaculately concepted? That's really, really cheezy if that's the case. Now that's just a matter of opinion, I agree. It would have been nice if it was clearly indicated that Palpatine himself or his ex-master actually created Anakin. But, it's just briefly mentioned that some guy at some time knew how to influence midichlorians. Thats all we get. Yawn....

Yes the Force concieved Anakin Through Smhi Skywalker. Palpatine lies to Anakin about influencing midichlorians to create life to lure him to the Darkside. Palpatine never created life nor his master, and he never learned to stop death either. He masterfully preys on Anakin's fears and seduces him, causing Anakin to murder the Jedi and anyone who opposses Palpatine. After Anakin turns there is no going back, he can not undue the evil he as done once he realizes he was tricked. Palpatine even admits to Anakin they can "learn" to stop death together, after Anakin joins Palpatine and commits his evil deeds.

 

Theres a huge plot hole. Luke asks "what do you remember about your mother your REAL mother. Leia answers that she doesnt remember much and that her mother died "very when she was very yong". First thing is, if your mother dies at childbrith your not going to answer that she died when you were "very young" you are going to say that she died "at childbirth" or "shortly after childbirth" or when she "gave birth" to me or something along these lines. Also to say you even have memories of your real mother when you are but a newborn is complete nonsense. Big hole that has never been repaired. But we all know Lucas makes it up as he goes.

 

Does the fact that this is not addressed really affect people's enjoyment of the film?

My own explanation is that as Star Wars is pure fantasy, anything is possible. So I let it rest. She could remember her mother. Some people on Earth even claim to remember being in the womb.

 

Also to say you even have memories of your real mother when you are but a newborn is complete nonsense. Big hole that has never been repaired.

Well, the way Leia remembers it is not necessarily how it happenned. Impressions and half memories from youth are very different from actual events.

 

I'm hoping for the return of Ric Olie, so he can explain everything to us.

"Obi-Wan, let me hold the twins while you load up your ship to fly Luke to Tatooine. My, look at the bright eyes on Leia. I bet she's smart enough to remember her mother even as a tiny infant, or possibly while she was still in the womb. That certainly seems plausible."

"Ok, Yoda and Chewbacca, break it up, it is time to move on here. Oh, and Chewbacca - I want you to forget all about Yoda as a Jedi master so that if you ever see Obi-Wan again, or perhaps see a younger Skywalker training obvious Jedi skills and weapons, you don't say anything to him about another surviving Jedi master if Obi-Wan gets killed and leaves him high and dry on board your ship with some guy named Han. Thanks."

"I'm starting to suspect that Chancellor Palpatine might be a Sith named Darth Sidious."

"Ok, here's Luke... have a safe trip to Tatooine, Obi-Wan. Oh, and apparently Shmi Skywalker's grave behind Owen Lars's house was desecrated by hungry Jawas and all trace of it was removed. The idea is so nauseating to Lord Vader that he has vowed never to visit the homestead again himself, making it a perfect place to hide Luke. Also, if some droids happen to end up there later holding stolen Death Star Plans, he has vowed only to send down Stormtroopers to his old stomping grounds, and not come himself. Take care!"

"I accidentally smacked C3PO in the head with a big electro-magnet. I hope that doesn't affect his memory circuits. Oh, and I figured out how to re-route his electric wiring so he shuts down properly now. This way if he, say, gets blown to pieces by a Stormtrooper or loses an arm, his head will shut down along with the rest of his body, instead of somehow staying turned on so it can be comically welded onto another droid."

"I turned off R2-D2's hoverjets. I don't think he'll ever have any use for them, even if he got stuck in a swamp or fell off a sail barge."

"Well, the Emperor sure seems to have taken over the Senate and set up an Empire. We'd best get moving, people! On the plus side, apparently due to his falling out with the Trade Federation and resultant embargo, it will take him almost 20 years to build any secret giant weapons he's working on. Oh, and to finish dissolving the Senate, because he's really lazy. See you back on Naboo!"

 

@ Leia's Starboard Hair Bun

 

Also to say you even have memories of your real mother when you are but a newborn is complete nonsense.

Yeah, and so is fire and sound in space, swords made out of light, and the ability to move objects and influence minds using a "mystical energy field that surrounds us, penetrates us, binds the galaxy together."

It's fantasy, not reality. Work with it.

 

"Yoda as a Jedi master so that if you ever see Obi-Wan again"

in ROTS, chewbacca never actually meets obi wan


and about the droid complaints:

watch TPM and AOTC again. obi wan never meets c3po, and how should he remeber r2d2? some insignificant droid that was congradulated ONCE en route to coruscant from naboo during the blockade? seems like a stretch...i dont remeber who sat in front of me, much less their name, on my ride to las vegas on a greyhound, even if they did help with that flat tire. why should anything else be expected of obi wan?

 

"Also to say you even have memories of your real mother when you are but a newborn is complete nonsense."

she isnt a normal child...she is strong with the force. emotional moments surrounding her birth could have been imprinted on her.

 

Luke is stupid because he assumes that to remember your dead mother you have to have actually known her at some point in your life.

Now he looks silly in that scene.

 

Well, I always thought from that smirk on old Obi's face when he sees R2D2 that he recognises the little droid, but is putting on his 'Must shield Luke' hat.

 

She said she remembered "images"... which could have been holorecordings she watched as a child... Bail was a senator too, remember?

 

1. Leia said she remembered "images, feelings"
2. Leia grew up as the adopted daughter of Sen. Organa.
3. Sen. Organa probably had holorecordings of Padme that she could show little Leia.
4. Leia grew up watching some of the holorecordings, thus she remembers the images and feelings of watching them.

There - no plot hole.

Undoubtedly covered in the forthcoming "intervening years" TV series?

Are you a writer, Tina? This sounds like an idea that could be used, seriously!

 

Are you a writer, Tina? This sounds like an idea that could be used, seriously!

I do write a lot, but no sci-fi... yet!

 

It actually makes MORE sense that R2D2's memeory is not erased.....

3PO: "How do you know there are settlements over there?" CUZ HE'S BEEN THERE!!

I bet that never crossed your mind before you made this brilliant thread.

 

^
You see, critics moan about plot holes, but I bet they've not watch the originals in years! I think that's a great point. You know why R2 can't tell 3PO!