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Speculation Rey's lineage...

Discussion in 'Star Wars: New Films - No Spoilers Allowed' started by Big Bad Yoda Daddy, Apr 10, 2016.

  1. Big Bad Yoda Daddy

    Big Bad Yoda Daddy Force Ghost star 4

    Mar 8, 2000
    I dare not venture into the SA forums now that filming is well underway, and since I couldn't find a thread for it here (admittedly, I didn't try very hard,) I thought I'd start it up here. My wife cracked a joke while watching TFA today, and the more I think about it, the more fun I started to have with the idea.

    Here we go:
    Rey's father is - wait for it - YODA. I know you're laughing, but I'm not kidding. Hear me out.

    #1 The music. We are meant to draw parallels between Rey and Anakin. See the attached video. In fact, the music presents us with the idea that Rey and Anakin are inverses of each other.

    #2 Many people believe that Rey is a Skywalker, some even believing she's a clone of Anakin. But let's be honest, Luke delivering a "Rey, I am your father" moment would be more on the nose than all of TFA combined. What if, instead, she's a Skywalker in the same way that Anakin was?

    #3 With the EU firmly in the garbage can for now, we can still make assumptions from the PT about Anakin's birth. We know from Shmi that his conception was immaculate, and we know from Palpatine that it is possible for dark side Force users to create life. Given Palpatine's intense interest in Anakin, it is still reasonable to assume that either he or Plagueis was Anakin's creator, for lack of a better word.

    #4 "I think it's time we inform the senate that our ability to use the Force has diminished." That was a bizarre plot point, don't you think? Notice when it happened? About the time Anakin began nearing his destiny. His connection to the Force as both a Jedi and a creation of the dark side are big enough plot points that these two events may not be coincidental. Keep in mind that Sidious was the only one who knew about the Force "diminishing."

    #5 Fast forward to TFA. The "who is Rey's family" bit is anything but subtle. JJ and company obviously WANT us to draw the conclusion that she is Luke's daughter. But if it's both obvious and the truth, why keep it a mystery?

    #6 When Rey touches Luke's saber, she has a vision. Only it's not Luke's - it's Anakin's. The only saber we can truly call Luke's was the green one used in RotJ. And what does she hear when touching Anakin's saber? Yoda and Obi-Wan. Gee - where have I seen Yoda, Obi-Wan, and Anakin together prior to the events of TFA? (Fun fact - Maz keeps the saber in a box that looks an awful lot like one Ben had in ANH.)

    #7 The end of RotS, all of ESB and RotJ, as well as the Mortis and Morriband arcs of TCW make it clear that force ghosts can act through the Force after their deaths. Qui-Gon instructs Obi-Wan how to retain his identity. (He also shows up for a really cool interaction with Ahsoka.) Obi-Wan helps Luke after his death. Yoda practically speaks directly to the Force in the Morriband arc and becomes a freaking living library. Even in Rebels, Yoda acts through the Force from across the galaxy to help Ezra.

    #8 "There's been an awakening. Have you felt it?" It was in the first trailer. It's the title of the movie. Obviously it has importance. What's going on when the Force Awakens? Rey is nearing her destiny. Who knows about it? The big baddie - but presumably Luke as well. (He obviously knows more than he lets on when Rey shows up.)

    Put all of these together (and I had more ideas when I was watching TFA that I'vesince forgotten,) and I don't think it's far-reaching to suggest that Rey is Yoda's creation in the same way that Anakin was Palpatine's. It explains why she's perhaps a little more powerful than she should be otherwise. It explains why whiny Kylo Ren seems like an uber-powerful badass. It explains why she's connected to more than just Luke, gives a more plausible explanation for her orphaning by a family who "is never coming back," and most importantly, how TFA can still be about a Skywalker. After all, with all of this in place, Luke would be her father - from a certain point of view.
    Lulu Mars likes this.
  2. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Chosen One star 5

    Mar 10, 2005

    Wouldn't it be more apt for her to be Anakin's creation, though? After all, those who learn to live on after death have been chosen to do so - meaning that there's a reason for them to live on. Apparently, Yoda and Obi-Wan were meant to teach Anakin the secret - but why?
    Well, maybe so that he could create his own successor...

    On the other hand, such manipulations might be confined to the dark side. She could be Snoke's creation.
  3. Tython Dawn

    Tython Dawn Jedi Knight star 1

    Dec 18, 2015
    I'm leaning heavily toward her being a Skywalker. The mad untrained piloting skills, the connection with the Skywalker lightsaber, and her obvious strong Force connection are pretty big clues.
  4. woj101

    woj101 Jedi Grand Master star 2

    Feb 19, 2000
    Good OP, thought-provoking. And thanks for the video - I have been away from Star Wars for a while (only since seeing TFA a 5 times, of course), so I wasn't aware of that inverse, which does indeed get me rubbing my hands in glee.

    However, your whole argument for your suggestion hinges on #3 and the ability to create life. Yes, we have grounds to believe Anakin was conceived immaculately, but I don't think we can trust the suggestion of Palpatine. I'm not saying it's not true, but we don't know (the word OP uses) that it is true.

    And as I have referred to previously in other threads, and Tython touches on too, Rey's pilot skills just seem like the big giveaway to me. Skywalkers are the only people who can fly pod-racers > Skywalkers are the only people who can bullseye womp-rats in a T-16 > Skywalkers are the only people who can sink a proton torpedo into a 2m-wide exhaust port > Skywalkers are the only people who can survive a chase on unfamiliar speederbikes through the Forest of Endor > Skywalkers are the only people who can evade a tie-fighter attack by 1st-time piloting the Millennium Falcon through the derelict innards of a Star Destroyer.

    Lulu - I think you'll find Anakin already has a successor. Two of them, in fact :)
    Darth Basin likes this.
  5. TCF-1138

    TCF-1138 Anthology/Fan Films/NSA Mod & Ewok Enthusiast star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Sep 20, 2002

  6. ChewieWe'reHome

    ChewieWe'reHome Jedi Knight star 1

    Aug 25, 2015

    As we once again wait (seemingly) endless months for new Star Wars films, probably one of the most popular topics to discuss/speculate over is Rey's lineage. So many theories have been thrown around that I honestly can't remember them all.

    Here's what has begun to bother me: Why does Rey's lineage HAVE to matter? Nobody ever seems to consider that. At this point it's become a foregone conclusion that, for whatever reason, Rey is obviously a descendant of someone important. And OBVIOUSLY this has to be a major plot point in the trilogy.

    You may argue that because the saga's story (so far) has all run through the Skywalker family, it makes sense. I personally don't believe that's 100% the case. Perhaps it is. But where's the fun of Rey being ANOTHER Skywalker (something that would surprise no one)? Or ANOTHER Solo (ditto)?

    This is my hope: As long as they've got everyone already thinking Rey is, say, a Skywalker, then they should really consider throwing a huge curve ball. Keep throwing little hints about her being Luke's daughter. Let it build & build & build.Then when the moment's right, Rey has an epiphany. She finally knows where she belongs. She is a Skywalker... Or so she thinks. Luke has to break it to her: she is not a Skywalker. She is not a Solo. She's "just" Rey. Her final test is to accept who she is, not who her family is. Just as Luke resisted his father's path, Rey must resist any other path besides the one she sets for herself. Only then will she fulfill her destiny.
    CowMoo, Sarge and KaleeshEyes like this.
  7. KaleeshEyes

    KaleeshEyes Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Feb 16, 2016
    Not a bad idea by any means. I don't get why Skywalker lineage has to be so sacrosanct.
  8. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Chosen One star 5

    Mar 10, 2005
    Even if she wasn't born a Skywalker, she might be one before the trilogy ends.
  9. Darth Chiznuk

    Darth Chiznuk Superninja of Future Films star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Oct 31, 2012
    Thread merged
  10. Darth Chuck Norris

    Darth Chuck Norris Jedi Master star 4

    Sep 13, 2014
    To address #5 in the original post, I don't think they're keeping Rey's lineage a secret. It's a secret to Rey because she has to progress through the story to discover who her family is.

    And on #6, I think the point of the vision when she picks up Luke's/Anakin's light saber is to show her lineage. Not so much as to say she is a direct creation of Anakin through the Force

    Also, I doubt we'll get a "Rey, I am your father." moment. I think it'll be Rey discovering and having the moment of realization.

    Maz basically telling Rey that whomever she's waiting for is not coming back, is a hint to Rey that it's up to her to start her journey within the Force, and part of that journey is locating Luke and/or her family.
  11. Lord TW

    Lord TW Jedi Master star 2

    Dec 25, 2012
    Am I the only one who noticed that Rey's light saber fighting style resembled Palpatine's?
    episodenone likes this.
  12. jasman

    jasman Administrator Emeritus star 4 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Aug 29, 1998
    All I know is, the first time I saw her I said to myself, "Wow, that girl could definitely be Padme's granddaughter! She looks just like her!"
  13. Master of None

    Master of None Jedi Master star 4

    Jun 14, 2016
    I too think she has a lot of Padames characteristics.
    Kylo has Anakins characteristics, whiny, throwing fits when he doesn't get his way, etc.
  14. CowMoo

    CowMoo Jedi Master star 3

    Aug 12, 2001

    if so, my hope is that it isn't because she is the biological offspring, but rather "adopted" into the Skywalker family. I've posted before where my hope is that she isn't related to the Skywalkers at all, and that she is a fairly ordinary person discovered to be Force-sensitive whose real parents are unknown, and unimportant to the overall story.

    Besides, if it did turn out that she is a Skywalker, it would raise questions on why she was abandoned on Jakku under the guardianship of a dubious character. At least Luke grew up in the caring Lars family.
    GMGalenMarek likes this.
  15. luketheforeigner

    luketheforeigner Jedi Youngling star 1

    Apr 16, 2016
    Padame being ray's mother is a cool theory and is very plosible did you come up with it your self?
    Darth Basin likes this.
  16. Grand Master Galen Marek

    Grand Master Galen Marek Jedi Knight star 4

    Jun 22, 2014
    Well I'm glad she has no ties to Anakin.
  17. Darth Basin

    Darth Basin Jedi Master star 5

    Aug 15, 2015
    Rey was a darkside experiment created from Luke's hand.

    Everybody wins scenario. She is a Skywalker yet Luke is not her father.
    Master of None likes this.
  18. Dark Lady Mara

    Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Jun 19, 1999
    Or... everybody loses, because the galaxy's fate is now in the hands of a dark side experiment... :p
    Darth Basin likes this.
  19. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Chosen One star 5

    Mar 10, 2005
    Rey's Theme closely resembles the Imperial March in both rythm and structure. If that's not intentional, I'm Captain America.
    Darth Basin likes this.
  20. Darth Basin

    Darth Basin Jedi Master star 5

    Aug 15, 2015
    I have seen art & cosplay of Dark Luke & Dark Leia. Leia seemingly more natural looking as a Darksider. Cool stuff but we all know deep down they're Lighsiders.

    But looking at Dark Rey stuff........

    She looks like she belongs........

    Scary, I know......

    Episode X Dark Rey? Light Ben?
    Lulu Mars likes this.
  21. Darth-Horax

    Darth-Horax Force Ghost star 6

    Aug 22, 2001
    I am thinking she's more of the daughter of the main character from Rogue I.

    Good pilot, rebellious would show why her parents supposedly left her behind to protect her. They were
    hiding from the empire and knew they probably wouldn't survive.

    In TFA, she's playing with an xwing doll from her youth and wearing a helmet that I assume was her father or mothers.
    People think she found it while scavenging, but what if it was left for her by her parents?

    Perhaps there's a connection between the pilot and another character, as well to explain the force connection and the vision?
  22. woj101

    woj101 Jedi Grand Master star 2

    Feb 19, 2000
    Assuming at least some consistency regarding the existing films, Rey's innate ability to pilot the Falcon, use mind tricks, and resist Kylo Ren without any guidance logically tells me she can't just be a 'random' character and that she has to be a Skywalker, or otherwise significantly related to a master of the Force.

    Having her turn out to be unrelated would be stretching the bounds of plausibility for me. Star Wars is the franchise that it is because of the lore and mythology established by the OT, and to a lesser degree the PT. It would be very risky of Disney to come along and try and turn things on their head with some big twist that undermines the existing films or requires them to be re-evaluated because there was some other hidden strain of Force-sensitive characters who never made themselves known. If they're prepared to 'disrespect' the OT/PT in that way they'd better have a very good idea, or their investment will start to look quite shaky (though the western world needs it's space opera fix so I guess there's money in it for a long time however they choose to meddle with it).

    If she's not a descendant of Anakin Skywalker, I can only see one (or two) alternative, that she's been conceived in a mysterious manner similar to Anakin, at the hands of a Snoke (Plagueis)/Palpatine character. Even less plausible would be her being conceived by another Jedi (e.g. Yoda, Obi-Wan) in some way. To me she can't be as innately strong in the Force as she is without making a mockery of our current concept of the Force unless she is related to one of the above.

    Whilst I have no idea how much attention Disney have really paid to George Lucas, this has always been a Skywalker saga, first and foremost. The high-level point of TFA is that it is the 7th episode of the Skywalker saga, with the central character known as Rey - ergo, Rey is a Skywalker. When it stops being a Skywalker saga, it's entered spin-off territory for me and my regard for the ST will likely quickly diminish. It would be like making a Godfather film that doesn't focus on the Corleone's, only moreso because Star Wars has 6 Skywalker films to Godfather's 3.
    Darth Basin likes this.
  23. Darth Basin

    Darth Basin Jedi Master star 5

    Aug 15, 2015
    I have no problem with Random characters. Lando, Ackbar, Qui-Gon, Mace. Not at all. But if you put 1 front & centre, (Rey?) well that is going against the wishes of the creator.
  24. Big Bad Yoda Daddy

    Big Bad Yoda Daddy Force Ghost star 4

    Mar 8, 2000
    I put my thoughts into more fleshed out, video form, should anyone be interested in that kind of thing:
  25. woj101

    woj101 Jedi Grand Master star 2

    Feb 19, 2000

    But if Luke 'created' Rey, and this 'awoke' the Force, why does the the Force only awaken when Rey is (insert her TFA age here) years old?

    Nice vid, but if I may offer a tip - don't film with a window next to you like that, makes for poor lighting of the frame as a whole. Next time try sitting facing the window, with the camera next to the window facing towards you) so that the light from the window illuminates you for the camera :)