Mini Series The Acolyte 1.08 (SEASON FINALE!!!) - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

This finale and the previous one for starters. None of the laughable attempts to pin all the blame on the Jedi are ever challenged in any meaningful way. Least of all by the Jedi who can't defend themselves from weak standard anti-Jedi rhetoric that we have heard a million times since the PT came out. Anti-Jedi rhetoric that is just blatant distortion of how the Jedi actually operate and what they believe in the George Lucas films. The Acolyte had to create its own version of the Jedi and then deconstruct it, because certainly these weren't the Jedi as created by George Lucas in the PT or the OT.

Sith like Mae and Osha are portrayed as justified in their desire for revenge against the Jedi for trying to save them from the evil cult of witches. Mae also gets to dodge all blame for burning down the compound. And evil witch coven leader also gets portrayed as a poor, helpless victim when she is anything but.

Ah, yes, I was accused of being hyperbolic when I didn't like TLJ or TFA either. I was told all sorts of things didn't happen in those films that I saw unfold right before my eyes.

Obviously I watched the show and commented on every episode in their respective threads as the show was released. I was also rocking Jecki as my avatar for several weeks.

My post history also demonstrates that I am completely transparent and forthright when I haven't watched a Star Wars show, and when I haven't watched a show, I don't go into individual episode threads and comment on the show.

I've been completely open about not watching Resistance, for example. Also about only seeing a few episodes of the Clone Wars and a bit of the first season of Rebels.

There is no real need to accuse me of lying about seeing the show just because I happen to have a different final opinion on and interpretation of the first season of the show than you do.

Except the show never gets around to showing much about how the Jedi supposedly "control" the galaxy since it is far too small in scale and scope to accomplish that. We also don't see much of how the Jedi govern or control themselves because Vernestra basically functions in unilateral opposition to the Council the whole time. And the idea that the Jedi or anyone could possibly control their emotions is treated as basically a sinister lie.

Except things like emotions are totally controllable by reasonably mature and self-disciplined adults who aren't Jedi. Plenty of people in our own world and in a galaxy far, far away exhibit control over their emotions even if they aren't Jedi. Emotional control isn't a unique Jedi power. My barely two year old niece will attempt to self-regulate her emotions.

My two year old niece is capable of more emotional maturity and intelligence than Senator Ravencourt, evidently. She will try to control emotions, but Senator Ravencourt will throw up his hands and be like, "Nobody can possibly control their emotions, and it's suspicious that anyone would even try to not be a bundle of uncontrolled anger, rage, fear, and vengeance all the time. It's super evil that anyone would try to have calm and internal peace instead of being a volatile tornado of destruction. We definitely have to keep an eye on those folks as the real villains."

Also, by his own logic, wouldn't it be a great folly and very suspicious for the Senate or anyone else to try to control the Jedi?

Since his whole premise is that nobody can control the uncontrollable and he seems to think that the Jedi and emotions are uncontrollable.

Anakin can't control his emotions because he deliberately chooses to reject Jedi teachings and wisdom and gives into the temptations of a Sith Lord who tells him to give into all his dark impulses and desires.

A Sith Lord who was also Supreme Chancellor of the Republic Senate.

That Republic Senate that Ravencourt wants to give more control over the Jedi.

Not a very reliable prophet is that Senator Ravencourt, after all.

What is the point of him and his fellow politicians having oversight if he thinks emotions are uncontrollable? Nobody will be able to control Jedi emotions or the emotions of anyone else, according to the excellent logic of Senator Ravencourt. In fact, why even have a government at all? Governments spend a lot of time trying to control the uncontrollable. By the logic of Senator Ravencourt, people will always commit murder, so why even bother to have a law against it?

Also, wasn't one of the main reasons people hated the PT Jedi was that they were supposedly too subservient to the Republic and its Senate, but with the Acolyte people hate on the Jedi for not submitting to enough oversight from Senator Ravencourt and his fellows.

Almost like no matter what fans will be determined to see Jedi in the worst possible light and blame them for others choosing to be evil.

That's not the case in Phase 1, Phase 2, or what we have seen so far of Phase 3 of the High Republic where the Jedi work closely with the Republic Senate and the Chancellor to achieve common goals. It's also not what we saw in the PT.

Too bad the creator of this show clearly has no respect for previous High Republic projects or for the PT and wanted to create her own version of the Jedi so she could have some strawman version of the Jedi Order for her characters to attack. Just a shame that some of those strawman Jedi had previously gotten better characterization in far superior earlier High Republic stories. Vernestra Rwoh being the ultimate casualty of that.

Mostly we see how an evil cult of witches and Sith Lords are portrayed as poor helpless victims of the Jedi. As if the Jedi are the real victims of the Star Wars universe.

Sol was justified in wanting to remove Mae and Osha from a cult of dark side witches who used black magic to create the girls and obviously were interrupted in the middle of a creepy ceremony to ritually sacrifice one or both of the girls. He also didn't do anything wrong slaying the evil leader of the witch cult coven who was drawing on her dark powers at the very moment his lightsaber passed through her.

That's the problem. This show thinks Sol committed some great crime when he didn't.

Arguably his only real mistake is not listening to the Council's ruling about not training Osha initially and participating in Indara's coverup.

I mean, I would have thought it was self-evident why Jedi would have rules about not giving into fear, anger, revenge, and hatred, and clearly the Jedi had rules about not giving into fear, anger, revenge, and hatred before the events of this show.

So I don't think it's something that needs to be explored in a poorly written fake mystery show that is all about deconstructing the Jedi and painting them as more evil than the Sith and the evil coven of dark witches.

What do they have in society? This show never shows that or builds that up in any meaningful way. It's too busy deconstructing the Jedi to do that.

Shame this show doesn't bother to delve into that complexity. Just paints the Jedi as evil because they try to control their emotions and not be ruled by fear, anger, hate, and vengeance a la the Sith. Also as constantly trying to cover up their supposed "crimes." Crimes that aren't even that bad.

This isn't even a good deconstruction of the Jedi.

Except for the final two episodes that are all about promoting that message, sure, it never says that.

Except the whole show is about Jedi and their various nefarious coverups.

The narrative didn't treat these as mistakes. It treated them as major crimes deserving of death.

I am not asking for that. Just that they not be portrayed as the villains more evil than the Sith and the Dark Side witches.

Would have been nice to see some of that authority or protection of the galaxy depicted in this show then.

Far more masterfully than anything in the Acolyte as it turns out.

 

Not explicitly, but implicitly, the last two episodes seem to be saying that, and the show really built itself up to hinge on the final two episodes and the answers given there.

I wasn't one of those people. I was super excited for this show because it was connected to the High Republic, which I love, and explored a different era in the timeline than previous Star Wars live action shows.

We could just as easily say that fans who defend and like the Acolyte are hyperbolic.Hyperbolic accusations can cut two ways.

And there is no reason to assume that anyone is a former Star Wars fan just because they watched eight episodes of the Acolyte and found the show not to be to their taste.

That is gatekeeping what it means to be a Star Wars fan.

A person is a Star Wars fan as long as they identify as such. There is really no other criteria to being a Star Wars fan than that.

Liking the Acolyte is certainly not a requirement for being a Star Wars fan.

Mistakes that were treated as worse than the crimes of the Sith and the witches in this show.

Might have been nice than if the show put even a tenth of the energy it put into deconstructing the Jedi into showing how selfish and evil the Sith are. Instead it just fixated on the crimes of the Jedi and how the Sith and the witches are the real hapless victims of the Jedi.

I don't hate the show. I am disappointed by the final two episodes that basically sank the show in my opinion.

I was rather enjoying the show and had a largely positive view of it until the final two episodes.

It was sort of like being on the Titanic. It was a nice voyage until the iceberg was hit.

I could talk about the grand staircase and how beautiful it was, but the fact remains it is at the bottom of the ocean now.

Saying that doesn't mean I hate the Titanic.

Same as how I don't hate characters like Jecki, but sadly the show that she was in ended up sinking in the final two episodes of its maiden voyage (aka season one).

I think I have been pretty fair in my criticisms.

I don't hate the ST. I just have my criticisms of it. Criticisms of it that I deem fair, but others judge as hyperbolic.

Though I probably like the Acolyte more than the ST.

What came before the iceberg and the sinking was strong enough for me to say that.

 

And the flaws of the Jedi in this story were mistakes from good intentions, rather than evil. That's an important distinction.

 

A broken Jedi allowing a person he loves, but who he committed a wrong against, to kill him does not have any bearing on him kicking the hell out of an evil Sith Lord.

In one case, he was in a duel.
In the other, he put up no fight.