What "Obi-Wan did" to Anakin?

No, they are no longer friend, the analogy is moot. Here's the thing, it's simple, in the GFFA, the Sith are evil and must be destroyed by the good guys the Jedi. See, there's things thing called the force, and it is good. The Sith distort and pervert the force, and throw it out of balance, until Vader kills Darth Sidious, and restores the balance.

 

Analogy is not moot. Ok then if you cant see the whole picture just say they are old friends turned enemies..then they see each other at a bar or wherever then blah blah blah

 

Except Obi-Wan doesn't want to fight. He doesn't pull out his lightsaber and then point it at Anakin....he actually points it away from Anakin. Obi-Wan would have much rather simply arrested Anakin, if that were possible. But, being a Sith Lord, Anakin has made it abundantly clear that he's not going to come peacefully. Anakin is the one who verbally threatens Obi-Wan's life....so Obi-Wan pulls out his lightsaber in defense. And then Anakin attacks, forcing Obi-Wan to fight him. Obi-Wan didn't start the fight; Anakin did.

 

Yeah^^^ Anyone who thinks Anakin was the victim has serious issues.

 

First, Obi-wan didn't know anyone was coming. Second, he didn't think Anakin would've survived as he did. Third, he was not feeling merciful that day. To continue would take him to a dark place that he did not want to go.

That was my point. Obi-Wan expected Anakin to die on the lava bank. It would have been less painful to kill him quickly. If Obi-Wan expected Anakin to die on Mustafar, then I don't see how striking the killing blow would be any different other than sparing him the suffering. Obi-Wan's intentions were to leave Anakin for dead, so killing him with a lightsaber should not have been a dark side act. Jedi are not supposed to take revenge or cause people unnecessary pain. That is why they only fight in self defense and take defeated opponents into custody instead of killing them outright. Leaving him to die on the lava bank accomplishes the same purpose as delivering the killing blow in Obi-Wan's mind and it causes a lot more pain, so it seems the Jedi thing to do would be to kill him and spare Anakin the suffering. Since being taken prisoner alive obviously wasn't an option at that point, I don't see how killing Anakin rather than letting him burn would be murder.

 

Now, I don't know, but I think this one would mess up continuity with the OT in obvious and important ways.

 

I think he meant at the time. Like those things you do that you instantly regret. I think Obi-wan regretted it. He was angry and hurt and bewildered. I think it hit more later, when Padme died and the kids were orphans. I think Obi-wan really realize thent hat he was rash. If he could have talked Anakin down, things would have turned out a whole lot better. He didn't even try. He made more effort with Ventress then Anakin.

 

You may have a point there. He sort of tried to talk Anakin down, but the situation was not really one for talking much. But there was perhaps another option besides maiming him like that. And it is an interesting point that in the EU Obi-Wan made a HUGE effort to get Asajj "back" to the light side, a far bigger one than he put forth with Anakin. Then again, even with the Jedi non-attachmet principal, Obi-Wan loved Anakin and felt shocked and betrayed, and no doubt confused.

 

Cruel? No. Necessary? Sure.

Obi-Wan gave Anakin a fair warning to not go fourth and jump. As much as he didn?t want to, Obi-Wan had to do what he had to do, even if it left Anakin dead or dismembered. Did Anakin deserve it? Yeah, I mean he did jump after being told not to.

 

Anakin did a lot of things that would make him deserving of a good torching and chopping.

 

Regardless of what Anakin did, Obi-Wan's supposed to be a good guy, and good guy's don't leave there former best friends to be burned alive. No amount of semantic trickery can absolve Obi-Wan of is iniquity here. What he did WAS evil, plain and simple, and the galaxy paid a terrible price for it.

 

No, Obi-Wan was doing what he thought was best, as he says "I will do what I must" AKA destroying the sith. This means Anakin. He left him for dead. He did his duty.

 

Good guys don't let the enemy go free, even if that enemy was once they're best friend.

 

Too bad he didn't realize should have killed him, but then you would lose all of your suited vader DFF.

 

Because, as the novelization states, Obi-wan was not in the merciful mood that day. The Jedi Code states that a Jedi must not kill in anger, hate or revenge. It says nothing about letting a person who is evil, suffer or not. Obi-wan didn't feel like a Jedi. He was a man who lost his brother to evil. Let the punishment fit the crime.

Now on to the matter of the duel. Obi-wan did ignite his saber first, but he did not attack first. There is nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is where a Jedi attacks first, such as Luke in TESB and ROTJ. Each time he fought Vader, he ignited first and made the first strike. On Mustafar, Anakin already made his intentions clear to Obi-wan, before he unhooked his saber.

ANAKIN: "Don't lecture me, Obi-Wan. I see through the lies of the Jedi. I do not fear the dark side as you do. I have brought peace, justice, freedom, and security to my new Empire."

OBI-WAN: "Your new Empire?"

ANAKIN: "Don't make me kill you."

OBI-WAN: "Anakin, my allegiance is to the Republic ... to democracy."

ANAKIN: "If you're not with me, you're my enemy."

OBI-WAN: "Only a Sith Lord deals in absolutes. I will do what I must."

(ignites his lightsaber)

ANAKIN: "You will try."

ANAKIN ignites his lightsaber.

Obi-wan gets ready to defend himself, but Anakin attacks first. Anakin already has made his intentions clear. He will kill him, if he will not join him.

 

I agree with you on a lot of things, but you're way off base on this one. You seem to think he was doing this out of revenge rather than out of duty, but there's nothing to back that up. Rather, you're excusing Anakin for his wrongdoings and saying that he shouldn't have had any reprocussions. And Obi-wan actually helped the galaxy out when he crippled Vader. Had he not lost some of his abilities he would have been unstoppable. Now that would have had dire consequences for the galaxy.

 

Exactly!

What Obi-Wan did was not revenge, it was damage control, I think. Just imagine: Anakin was destined to be one of the most powerful Jedi ever, right? Then, it goes without saying, he would become the most powerful Sith as well!

Also, if Jedi (what is the official plural of Jedi, btw? lol) always do what they MUST, no amount of previous friendship between Obi Wan and Anakin would save the latter from the former's duty!

And those who say that Obi Wan couldn't do that to Anakin for friendship's, or even Jedi Way's sake are forgetting that he isn't supposed to love him so much in the first place! No matter who is in front of him, if it's evil and threatens Peace and Good, a Jedi must strike.

Ah, but there's the point of cruelty... For my part, I give Ben the benefit of the doubt: in my mind, when he left, he thought "Ani" was dead or was going to die. Also, I don't think it is in the realm of impossibility to say that Obi Wan might have had a moment of anger. Jedi Master or not.

In short, feelings, something Jedis have to have in minimal quantity, is what lost them all.

First post, here. Hope I'm not rubbing anyone the wrong way.

 

Anakin wasn't his friend. He was his enemy. The galaxy was already paying a price for Palpatine was in control. Killing Vader would've made it worse because then the Force would never be brought back into balance. Obi-wan's compassion regarding killing unarmed men would prove to be the salvation of everyone.

 

Let me see how well I can explain this....
1) Jedi are not permitted to strike down an unarmed and helpless opponent, ever. Even if their opponent is a Sith Lord.
2) Jedi are also not supposed to exceed necessary force. They hope to disarm and arrest their opponent rather than kill them.

Now, during the battle itself, the Jedi has to make the best decision he can as to which will be the best course of action. He can either try to disarm his opponent, or he can try to kill him. It's up to his own personal judgement, which is why years of training are especially helpful in this area. If it's simply a little child walking around with a gun, then the Jedi should make every attempt to disarm them, rather than kill them outright. But if one of the greatest bounty hunters in the galaxy is trying to kill them, then the Jedi can make a judgement call and decide to kill their opponent rather than waste time playing games with them. Either course of action CAN be permitted under the Jedi Code, depending upon all the circumstances, but the Jedi himself has to make the final call.

Situation 1: Anakin Skywalker is fighting Count Dooku, a Sith Lord. Anakin has two choices. He can either attempt to disarm and arrest Count Dooku, or he can attempt to kill him. It would be perfectly acceptable to simply kill Dooku in battle. But Anakin decides to attempt to disarm and arrest him. Anakin succeeds. At this point, the decision has already been made and carried through, and it cannot be undone. Anakin could have continued the fight and struck the final blow, but he decided not to. Now the battle is over. And since Dooku is an unarmed and helpless prisoner of war, and it WOULD be against the Jedi Code to kill him. With Palpatine's encouragement, however, Anakin decides to kill Dooku out of revenge. The Jedi Code states that a Jedi must not kill in anger, hate or revenge. Anakin has broken the Jedi Code.

Situation 2: Mace Windu is fighting Darth Sidious, a Sith Lord. Mace already attempted to place the Sith Lord under arrest once, and Sidious resisted. Mace has two choices. He can either attempt to disarm and arrest Darth Sidious, or he can attempt to kill him. It would be perfectly acceptable to kill Darth Sidious in battle. But Mace decides to attempt to disarm and arrest him. Mace succeeds, and places Sidious under arrest for a second time. The battle should be over. Sidious, however, decides to continue the battle by unleashing Force Lightning from within himself to attack Mace. Now that the battle has been re-ignited, Mace changes his mind, and decides kill the Sith Lord in battle instead of attempting arrest a third time. Immediately after defeating Sidious' Force Lightning, Mace raises his lightsaber to strike the final blow....and is interrupted by Anakin Skywalker. The battle is not over; it is merely paused. Mace, still fully prepared to finish the battle and kill Sidious, tries to explain the situation to Anakin. Anakin isn't understanding. Mace doesn't have time for a discussion like this. He resumes the battle, raises his

 

It was life or death.

The Anakin Obi-Wan knew was gone and he had to defend himself

 

Because, as the novelization states, Obi-wan was not in the merciful mood that day. The Jedi Code states that a Jedi must not kill in anger, hate or revenge. It says nothing about letting a person who is evil, suffer or not. Obi-wan didn't feel like a Jedi. He was a man who lost his brother to evil. Let the punishment fit the crime.

Do people feel that if Obi-Wan struck the killing blow he would have been breaking the Jedi Code? In my mind, allowing him to die in the fire is the equivalent of Obi-Wan killing him with his own hands, since Obi-Wan put Anakin in that situation. Do you feel that Obi-Wan's actions were better than killing him outright? I don't think so since Obi-Wan expected him to die. Making an evil person suffer so the punishment fits the crime sounds like revenge (eye for an eye) to me. If they weren't fighting near lava and Anakin was not in a life-threatening situation, what should Obi-Wan have done? Taking him prisoner really isn't an option since the Jedi have no legal authority anymore. Since Obi-Wan was on a mission to destroy the Sith, I think it would have been acceptable to strike the killing blow. If the Republic was still in existence, he would have to take Anakin prisoner, but as I said, that cannot be done.

 

I don't think that if Obi-Wan killed Anakin it would have broke the Jedi Code. I just don't think he could do it, even if he wasn't feeling merciful. I think the important thing to take away from Obi-Wan's actions is that he appears to be leaving Anakin's fate to the will of the Force. He no doubt believes he will die on that bank, but doesn't make personally sure it happens... and of course, without actually doing it himself, he doens't know it will happen for sure. So leaving Anakin there seems to point to Obi-Wan leaving up to the Force. It feels quite meaningful to me that way.

 

I'd encourage you to read my previous post, in addition to this one, if you haven't already done so.

If Obi-Wan wanted to strike the killing blow, then he should have done so as Vader leapt over his head. That would have been killing an opponent in combat; perfectly acceptable. But once Obi-Wan made the decision to disarm him rather than kill him, and carried that action through, the battle ended....and Vader automatically moved down to the level of any other disarmed and helpless opponent. So, unfortunately, yes, it would be against the Jedi Code for Obi-Wan to murder him at that point.

In the long run....yes, because it gave Anakin a chance to redeem himself.

He probably should have simply decided to kill him instead of disarm him. But, given that he didn't, all Obi-Wan can do after disarming him is either arrest him or leave him there. And if, as you pointed out, it's pointless for Obi-Wan to arrest him because the government is no longer capable of bringing him to justice....then he should just leave him there. And if you think that's cruel, then you should simply be upset that Obi-Wan decided to disarm him instead of killing him in battle when he had the chance. But then realize the consequences that such a decision would have had for the galaxy. I believe Obi-Wan, without realizing it, may have been so much more of an instrument of the Force at that moment then he could have ever possibly known. Any other Jedi would have instantly sliced Darth Vader in two, given such an opportunity....except Obi-Wan. He was the only Jedi in the galaxy who would have ever given Darth Vader a second chance to earn redemption and fulfill his destiny.

 

This is a wonderful observation. The jump that Anakin attempted is the very same jump Maul made. But, Obi-Wan clearly had better skills and was able to "handle" Anakin's jump. The key is...Obi Wan said "don't do it." And hard-headed, angry Anakin did it anyway.

The bottom line is Anakin's weakness and fear brought all this on him.

Obi-Wan should have killed him and taken him out of his misery. Read the book it gives all the details

 

Read the book it gives all the details

If more people did that, half of these threads would be unnecessary.