Who was stronger in RotJ, Vader or Luke?

Luke was more impressive cause he did what I believe no one else could do which was one turn his father back ,and two he stood up to the emporer, no matter the circumstances. That shows some kuhunas to me man!

 

I don't know if Sidious thought Vader was his loyal servent. With the ways of the Sith, Sidious I'm sure thought Vader still desired to overthrow him even after 20+ years of "loyal" service. It was arrogance on the part of Sidious that allowed Vader to take advantage and destroy him. Sidious believed that Vader couldn't challenge him one on one because Sidious's Force lightning would easily take down Vader. But as Vader carried Sidious and threw him over, you have to believe that Sidious was blasting Vader with full power and it didn't seem to effect Vader from easily carrying Palpatine. Luke on the other hand, went down in 2 seconds as Palpatine blased him with much less than full power Force lightning. Advantage Vader.

 

there is some truth to this, but i question if it's an advantage.

i would suggest to you that it is simply likely that Anakin suffered such damage to the nerves in his body when he burned on Mustafar that he couldn't feel the pain as Luke and Mace, or even Anakin himself.

Let us keep in mind that when the same Anakin was hit with a relatively weak blast of lighting from Dooku he went down even faster than Luke.

Also it is not a major suprise that he was able to last that long since he knew the moment he turned on his master he'd die for it he was prepared for the blast that he took.

I do agree that Vader is very impressive and i don't think anyone else would have lasted that long against the full power Sidious unleashed on him, i'm just not sure it's an advantage to be able to suffer and act while being mortally wounded.

 

Pain tolerance =/= Strength in the Force. Luke also took the lightning head on, whereas Vader merely was hit with lightning that curved back towards him while he carried Palpatine.

 

Palpatine ofcourse. He is more powerful than Vader and Luke combined multiplied a thousand times and then another thousand.

 

While I don't know that it's quite to that extent(though it's still by a large amount) I do agree Palpatine is more powerful than either, it's just that's not the question the thread is asking.

 

I think Vader hands down was more powerful in every respect....except will. He did not have it in him to kill his own son.

 

hyperbole much?

 

As far as a quote to back up my statement, it's in the annotated screenplays. It specifically tells you how the fight was going to end in different drafts. Luke kills Vader in the the first few drafts.

 

Yeah, I think I remember Kershner(or it may have been Kurtz) saying something similar when he leaked what could have been if they'd done all 9.

 

Luke, I must say, was more powerful.

 

Though Luke has the advantage in the duel, I still believe Vader is stronger. By this point Vader had come to control his fear to use it to his advantage, Luke was holding his own and all but if he wouldnt kill Vader he would be killed himself. He only got the true upperhand when Vader threatens to turn Leia and he rushes at him swinging and screaming. He then keeps attacking Vader even as he's on the floor defenseless and cuts off his arm. Once Luke regains himself he is tortured and eventually Vader is the one to kill the Emporer and himself. Luke didn't do either..

 

Dooku's lighting was nothing compared to Sidious's watch the difference in how Yoda handles both lol Also remember in ref to Anakin "my powers have doubled since last time Count" Dooku didn't even try his lighting in his rematch with Anakin

 

The emphasis in that last sentence was mine, but I think that sentence sums up perfectly how Luke & Anakin were different. Sure there were some similarities between the two (mainly in their recklessness & impatience) but in the end they were very different from each other. Where Anakin consistently failed Luke got it right. The key difference between the two I think is that where Anakin was selfish, Luke was selfless.

Training is important but it isn't the end-all & be-all of measuring a Jedi or Sith's abilities. Dooku had much more training than Anakin when Anakin killed him, but could anyone argue that Dooku was more powerful than Anakin in RotS. Anakin obviously surpassed him in raw ability.

Likewise by RotJ Vader was surpassed by Luke in raw ability.

 

Vader was the strongest by far IMO. Luke was able to beat him because that was what was supposed to happen. Vader was supposed to lure Luke over to the dark side, not kill him. If Vader was going to kill Luke then I'm pretty sure he would have succeded.

 

I think overall, Vader was still stronger than Luke. But, since neither was trying to kill the other, its hard to tell. Vader was just trying to beat Luke into submission, to turn him to the Dark Side, and Luke was trying to convert Vader back to the Light Side. Neither was going for the kill, so who knows? But, considering their fight in TESB, its obvious Vader was just toying with him, testing Luke to see if he was any good at all. I just can't believe that Luke could surpass Vader in skill in the months between TESB and ROTJ.

 

Luke.

Vader was getting too old and his body too deteriorated, Luke definitely had the upper hand in that last battle

 

moraly vader was stronger to overcome his obedience to his master and renew his loyalty to his son. i think vader was the strongest in the end.

 

However, from a moral stand point, wouldn't it have been stronger to have resisted the temptation like Luke did, rather than succumb to evil in the first place?

 

Vader was stronger. The only time Luke had an advantage over him, was when he was in a state of rage over Vader threatening to turn Leia.

 

Yes, but neither was really putting their all into it until that point.

 

Completely agree. Vader wasn't trying to kill him, although when Luke was chopping at him like a block of wood, I sure got the impressions HE was trying to kill Vader.

 

I'm going with Luke, Vader got owned.

 

true good point

 

From a moral stand point, then yes Luke would be stronger. But as far as physical strength/Force goes I think Vader was stronger or they were about even.