ST George Lucas and the Mystery of the Treatment

Are you talking about the Lucas-only people who want the film to fail? I see them all the time. What I think happened was that the second trailer got a really positive response, especially Han and Chewie. It was rather difficult for some fans to take. Then there is the going back to more practical effects motto, its a sly we don't want another PT on our hands. It has to hurt. I know it hurt when the Star Wars Trilogy was desecrated with a bunch of CGI crap and random PT elements.

The "I told you so" crowd are hoping the movie flops and people hate it. That's not going to happen. Accept that reviews will say they are better than the PT and Lucas was wise to retire. Remember that there are fans who only came back into the fold because it will be different than the Lucas PT era. So stop with the you are only a real Star Wars fan if you like 1-6 garbage.

I think they took a look at the outlines and did scrap a lot. It will still go from point A to point B, but the journey will be different. Hopefully better.

 

I don't think anyone said Arndt didn't complete a draft. It's just that nobody approved any of his work for filming. But they did build sets and effects based on his work, because they were under construction before JJs script.

 

That's fine. I'm a fan of the following cult classics:

• Flash Gordon (1980)
• Tron
• Dark Crystal and Labyrinth

I can see exactly why someone wouldn't like any of these movies for one reason or another. I also recognise the flaws in something like Tron--I don't pretend they don't exist, I just say "They don't matter to me personally." That's what I find odd about the PT diehards--that they can't just love them personally, they have to prove that they're objectively great and widely loved.

 

Yeah, they needed someone to hack, err, write a script fast.

 

Oh. I read an article which suggests there was no actual screenplay on the table from Arndt. A lot of ideas seemed to be abounding which I presume they began set construction on etc.. See what you make of it..

http://www.theguardian.com/film/fil...s-issue-six-takeaways-about-the-force-awakens

 

"Original screenwriter Michael Arndt left after failing to deliver so much as a draft of the script" is just an assumption that The Guardian is making. Kasdan often uses the term "no script" when he means no shooting script. For instance, when he talks about having "no script" when he started on ROTJ, he actually means there were 3 or 4 drafts before he started working. It doesn't mean no drafts were written.

"We don't have a script" is often Hollywood lingo for "We haven't accepted a script."
In the Vanity Fair article, they say they just hadn't approved anything, not that nothing was submitted.

Someone will clear Arndt's name if this assumption is false.

 

Correct - in terms of having a script that every department can work off so they can shoot.

This article does muddy the waters slightly as the way it's written does make it seem as if Ardnt didn't pull together a draft, but that to me is quite hard to believe. It's not impossible Arndt did deliver draft or drafts. 10/11 months is a long time not to deliver anything. 6 months is ample time to write a strong script. Two/ three months is doable. Hell, I'm sure you can find films that are great where the script was written even faster (although more time is normal and this was clearly done after a script dead-end and under a heck of a lot of pressure for all involved). The script will also be worked on during the shoot as well. Lets not forget George was delivering the ROTS draft similarly late in the day I believe.

 

I have no problem with revising on the set. It was done on both Empire Strikes Back and Revenge of the Sith.

 

D.P...

 

Here is the exact passage from the VF article/interview where the Guardian takes their chain of thought from...

'With Abrams now part of the development team and the already tight summer 2015 release date looming ever closer, Michael Arndt was having difficulty finishing a script within the necessary time frame. “There was a ton of ideas and outlines, a lot of cards on the wall, a lot of writing on whiteboards,” Abrams said, but no screenplay.'

Taken literally, there may be a whole raft of people reading that from VF that may conclude that Ardnt did not finish what he was hired to do...complete a finished screenplay. He may very well have written drafts but it does not come across too clearly. And that is Abrams remarking, not Lawrence 'no script to see here' Kasdan.

 

Creative writing is a difficult business, but if you can't produce a Star Wars feature film script in the time Arndt had, he's WAY the wrong person for the job. I don't care what awards he has. It's Star Wars.

If anything you show up with two completely stories just in case you didn't like the first one.

 

If it is so difficult for an oscar-winning writer to produce a good script with a long time, how much harder do you think it is for someone who isn't an oscar-winning writer to produce a script in even less time?

 

Look, idiots abound in the world. But I haven't noticed much in the way of people here attacking someone else for liking the PT. Are there some folks who absolutely hate the PT and say so often? Sure, but you just have to get over that. Heck, i'm flabbergasted anyone thinks the PT is better than the OT. But people like what they like.

 

Well, depends on the writers, doesn't it? After all, writing is not a mechanical process, but a creative process. Creativity is not something that can be turned on and off. Perhaps Arndt had some ideas, but just wasn't able to connect them togeterh in a satidfactory manner. Maybe he couldn't find the right tone, Maybe the a character or two eluded him.

I mean, do you think Nobel Laureate Toni Morrison could write a great Harry Potter novel? Maybe, but maybe not. It's not exactly in her wheelhouse.

 

That's not really how it works, Ray. There's no real formula to this. Development is a very fluid, often very tricky process. All that matters is what the script is like at the end of it and as of yet, we have no idea.

 

If GL story was about learning stuff about the force that sounds cool. Wouldnt mind either story. But I doubt they got rid of all Georges ideas.

 

Having now read the Vanity Fair article in full I'm even more stoked and confident that they've done the right thing

 

right and people who hate them, i can't understand why they don't hate them personally. i'm laughing at this new narrative that it's only prequel lovers who are creating all the arguments. Priceless.
Go anywhere on the internet and mention the prequels and the hatred and arrogance of prequel hate blows the doors off.
the "george ***** my childhood" phrase was clearely out dominated by "I love the prequels"

I agree that people should just stop trying to get others on your side, but the last day or so of this false narrative that it's the prequel lovers stirring things up is delusional at best.

perhaps we get tired of every single person trashing on the movies we love, and when we come to a star wars board we assume we'd at least not have to hear the same super hate on the message board that is here for fans of said movies.

 

No, it isn't.

You're essentially proving the point I was making earlier in the thread: You're a person who can't handle the idea that someone doesn't like what you like and it annoys the living hell out of you that people say so from time to time, to the point where you use the term "arrogance" to describe "prequel hate" as if it's actually a personal and societal problem. It isn't. It's just someone somewhere who doesn't like a movie you like. That's it.

It's on you to let that go. You don't have to engage with it, or entertain it. You are not powerless to take every dart thrown at those movies right into your chest.

 

MODified: I'll save you the trouble of removing yourself from the argument.

 

Wow. The ban hammer has been flying fast and furious today. It's kind of like watching Harry Hart take out a fundamentalist hate group.

 

perhaps Arndt's inability to get a draft done was due to the... esoteric-ness? of georges treatments?
maybe that was part of the struggle

 

That's a reasonable guess.

As talented as Arndt is, maybe he struggled to 'get into Lucas's head' as did Brackett.

 

i could see it being very difficult if the themes and concepts were vastly different and muddled in gray areas
Arndt trying to wrap his head around the OT style and whatever George had conceived of for these new films.