Is the PT on too much of a large scale?

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Fireant, Apr 19, 2003.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Moderators: Darth_Nub, Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn
  1. Fireant Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 26, 2002
    star 1
    When u watch the OT it seems as it is a bit cramped compared too the PT. Does anyone agree?
    All the vast city's and CG make the OT feel over shadowed. But the OT has better acting and more body so that over shadows the PT.
  2. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Better acting? [face_laugh] "I don't think so."


    Anyway, it's true that the PT is very epic. But is that not the way Old Ben described it to Luke? We're watching the death of a millenia old Galactic Republic. I think the epical picture we're seeing is perfect. :)
  3. JediLegOBlock Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2003
    star 1
    I think in TPM GL spent too much time on making the PT a 'wow' factor in terms of scale. I get his intent - I am just not happy with the execution. AotC started to get better.
  4. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    The PT is on a grander scale, yes, but that lends itself to the OT, so that the OT also becomes grander than what we thought it was before. This is because we get more background to the events that take place in the OT. We have the backstory of Boba Fett(who I believe is the DNA host for the clones in EpIII and also by the time of the OT), Anakin´s story, Obi-Wan´s and Yoda´s history as two of the greatest servants of the old Republic etc.
  5. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    And don't forget the genius of Palpatine. :)


    Now we see that Palpatine really did earn the title "Emperor". Anyone who could fool an entire galaxy like that and not be caught until he himself is ready (I'm assuming) is much more than just a "cartoony" villain, eh? ;)
  6. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    Yes indeed. I admire that man, I really do.
  7. anakinsrightarm Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2002
    star 3
    I think it HAS to be on a "large scale" by default...it's simply telling a bigger story.

    The OT was very much small scale with a focused, narrow plot, really....a band of rebels trying to overthrow the evil Empire and restore the order of the Old Republic. It was that simple. LOTS of things could purposefully remain vague and they DID....

    But the whole NATURE of the PT was to flesh that all out and describe the events that made the OT happen....which really is a bigger, much more complicated and involved story.

    Some people have complained about the intricacies of the PT plot...that it's too boring....too expository...not FUN enough. But it's the story GL outlined 30 years ago...with very little fundamental change to the overall plot.

    If anything, I think the PT overshadows the OT.....While I LOVE the originals and grew up with them, I also think much more thought has gone into the PT...which, to me, is much more captivating and provocative. The OT was fun, but didn't exactly require a lot of deep thought. The PT has made me THINK an awful lot....and I'm glad. The last thing I would've wanted was the "adventures of Anakin Skywalker"....fun Jedi adventures for fun-sake.

    I love the depth and richness of the PT story....If anything, IT overshadows the OT.
  8. Fireant Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 26, 2002
    star 1
    I Agree with what u say but I ment that the PT over shadows the OT. Let me explain what I mean :- The main problem is that in my view the OT looks a bit out dated with all the CG that take up an ufull lot of the PT. I know that its the way forward in the film industry but I fell that GL should of toned it down just a little. In the AOTC (a fine film) all the clone troopers are not men in costumes they are CG, the stormtroopers in OT look real and he should of stuck too that methord. I think that because the OT was made over 20 years ago and the PT is made now the matching up is harder. If GL had of made the OT now I'm very sure that it would of been on a grander scale, You would of seen the Emperor's palace more Imperial meetings on a grand scale it just boiles down to the fact that GL was limited with Effects and money. He made the SE OT with added GC which was a good thing, because the OT was made first it seems that (in looks) it is the PT againsed the proper PT with all its jazzy CG and flash ships because of the big gap in the films being made GL should of used methods like he did in the OT more and not so much GC, that would make the films look more closer. Remember that the PT is 30 years or so before the OT and all that GC make it look ahead of the OT.
  9. YodaDaMan13 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2002
    star 1
    The only thing that bothers me is that the PT was made in the late 70's and early 80's. Now with the PT they are made with todays technology. I fear that when my son watches 1-6 in order he will be disappointed with the last 3 since they lack the technical work of the PT. But then again, when the special editions came out, they did fix alot of the holes. The PT is on a much larger scale compared to the 3 I grew up watching.
  10. anakinsrightarm Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2002
    star 3
    Fireant:

    The truth is that TECHNOLOGY has allowed the PT to be more extravagent...we can all see that and agree to that. These movies are much more advanced, which is what you're saying....so then we segue into the OT and things suddenly aren't so "awesome"...a bit more low key...a bit less dynamic, visually.

    I think Lucas has a convenient TOOL for this...and that's the story. Heck, he's even said as much....Doug Chiang too. When they started developing the "look" of TPM, it was envisioned that the forms be more fluid....more rounded...more romantic and elegant looking...more colorful. This was a bit of HAPPY COINCIDENCE, because the time that PRECEDED the Empire was more regal. It was like the roaring 20s, if you will, versus the upcoming Great Depression....the more bleak-looking time followed the decadence of a more prosperous time. After the Empire succeeded the Republic, all the "beauty" fell to waste....the Emperor was not concerned with aesthetics and architecture.....his was a simpler aim. Ships went from being colorful and organic looking, to stark...grey...more geometric, with hard edges. Basically the beauty and elegance evaporated along with democracy.

    My dad saw TPM and said "I don't remember the first SW looking like THIS..!" And he's right....What comes later is the result of stripping away that beauty. Again, this works CONVENIENTLY for Lucas...because originally he could only do so much...the designs were simple....rather colorless....and in the end this allowed him to be more OPEN with how things looked before the Empire.

    As far as the battles go, yes...things like the Clone War dwarf any attack of the Rebels on the Empire later on...but that's to be expected too. It was a more EPIC time....The Rebels are a relatively small band, versus an entire galaxy trying to hold onto democracy. Therefore you can expect things like the downfall of the Republic to be more GRANDE in appearance.

  11. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Good post, Mr. Appendage. :p :)
  12. JediLegOBlock Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2003
    star 1
    I think the point is that in the OT we realised how big the galaxy was without the need to be shown how big it was.

    GL uses way too many establishing shots in the PT. Kamino and Naboo are two good examples.
  13. Moog Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2003
    star 1
    I disagree with that. Establishing shots are very important, and the more the better! They add to the atmosphere.

    I think it's true to say that the prequel story is more of an epic story, while the later story is more closely tied to the characters. But I'm of the opinion that we should stop dividing the story into prequel and original, and start embracing the whole...
  14. anakinsrightarm Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2002
    star 3
    I agree with Moog. Establishing shots ARE important. And now they're much more effective than they ever were before. In the OT you either didn't have them much at all (because technology wasn't up to the vision) or it was simple movement against a matte background. But even THEN that was important.

    We need to be TAKEN and shown in Star Wars. Why, because we need to have it shown to us? No. But rather because these vistas are incredible and we SHOULD be shown them. It enriches the experience, it doesn't cheapen them.
  15. Krash RSA Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 11, 2000
    star 5
    but I fell that GL should of toned it down just a little WHY? By that mentality, GL should have showed his respect for the old Flash Gordon movies...by having all the ships fly around on noticable wires? GL has always been about improving the technology of moviemaking (to better tell his stories) Even directors like James Cameron have said they think the advances made by ILM for their projects...were so GL could have something better for his next film. Lucas has always worked to advance the technology of movies!

    GL should of used methods like he did in the OT more and not so much GC...re-read my last comments. And realize that GL wanted the PT to be on a larger scale then OT; it could be part of the reason he started with ANH? anakinsrightarm had a very good point about GL's ability to envision the Republic as an almost Camelot-style place; where a great society is torn apart by war.

    Establishing shots are very important, and the more the better! They add to the atmosphere....again, excellent point Moog! As a storyteller, it's GL's job to give the audience a sense of where they are. Don't think of these movies as something we've all seen dozens of times...as a director, GL has to establish a location.

    Otherwise, all we'd have for background information is "internet gossip" (and we all know how much to rely on that)
  16. Jack-D-Ripper Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2002
    star 2
    The Prequel Trilogy is telling a VAST story compared to the OT. The PT is telling the story of how an entire Galaxy became dominated by an Empire. The characters in the PT are really being played against this huge sweeping background. I actually like it though, its different to the more personal OT. What is tending to happen though, is that Lucas is deferring much of the story into huge visuals. A picture is afterall worth a thousand words, and it is the only way to get this sweeping story into a mere three two-hour films. I think Lucas has done it well personally. The PT gives me totally new and different things to love about Star Wars, things the OT didn't have. Look, see my signiature to see that I think that as films, the OT films are better, but that doesn't mean the PT doesn't have a lot to offer me.

    -JDR.
  17. JediLegOBlock Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2003
    star 1
    Well, I thought the chase scene in AotC was far more revealing about Coruscant than the establishing shots used in TPM of Coruscant.

    And really, did we need to see ANOTHER establishing shot of Theed in AotC? GL established the look of Naboo in TPM so we could recognise it if we saw it again...
  18. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    Yes, we needed another establishing shot of Theed, because we needed to get a new feeling for it, since it had changed very much. And it would´ve felt very weird not to have an establishing shot of it.
    What´s wrong with establishing shots?!
Moderators: Darth_Nub, Lt.Cmdr.Thrawn
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.