"Patience, my Blue Friend"

well, what is not known is that most Toydarians are born bright green. Some, however, wish instead to be Twileks so they undergo expensive skin-bleaching and dyeing processes, until they achieve a rich blue tone. Lucas failed to show us the interview Watto gave on the Holonet, denying he had bleached his skin, dismissing such questions as "crazy", and defended his right to own young boys, and even to serve them bottles of "Jedi Juice" and affirmed he would never, ever hurt a child.

 

i bet qui-gonn saying that line is the real underlying reason for the whole Clone-Wars.

wrap that around your noodle

 

Did that line bring down the Republic? I thought that was 'yippee!'

 

Watto is blue. What's the problem?

 

"When Han Solo calls Jabba, "a piece of worm ridden filth". "

No, no, He's being racist against Filth not worms. I never knew Han was Filth bigot

 

>>> Watto is blue. What's the problem?<<<

The Grand Wizard talking to one of his chums. "Hello, my white friend." See the problem? Qui Gon disgusts me.

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Dude, did he say 'negro'?

oh i forgot, he calls himself a "right-winger". They only respect aryans.

 

Are you talking to me?

 

Not cool. No more comments about people being aryans. Keep your posts off the posters and on the topic where they belong.

 

Oh my God. Perhaps that line does have the power to destroy things after all. It's destroying the harmony on this thread.

 

In a Universe where there are myriad lifeforms of multiple body configurations, abilities and colours, racist terminology becomes irrelevant (unless a fascist organisation exerts overt control, such as the Empire - which we still don't know for sure was an overtly racist organisation, despite the assertions in much secondary SW material).
Qui-Gon was merely referring to Watto's clear and directly observable physical appearance. It would be as if you had a friend with very many tattoos, perhaps even on his face. You might, in such a discussion over a wager, refer to him as "my illustrated friend" as both a diminutive, slightly joking term and as a subtle way of 'talking down' to him. Remember, Qui-Gon was engaged in a banter-type exchange which usually involves a bit of psychological back-and-forth. Watto's earlier "you think you're some kind of *Jedi*?" comment might be seen as similar. Qui-Gon did not appear to take umbrage, despite the put-down after his mindtrick failure.

In any case, Watto might have considered his skin colour as a cause of pride, rather than offense. As in my above example, a tattooed person might consider reference to the body art as a humorous acknowledgement of their real appearance, and not be insulted at all.

I believe the original poster's analogy to 'black' people is not a good one, since African-descended people are not actually 'black' - more chocolate coloured (which is delightful!). Watto was, in the truest sense, blue.

 

I just contacted the Confederation Of Blue People and the Organisation For Upholding The Good Name Of Blue People on Earth and they don't seem to have a problem with it.

They did however dissaprove of a Blue character being associated with gambling and cheating and have vowed to picket Skywalker Ranch until Uncle George issues an apology.

 

I will say this- the more I watch the PT the more I realize different aliens are stereotypes of prominent Southern California racial demographics... whether that is ultimately intentional or not depends on your point of view. Lucas hates LA, so it's possible that some of the more loathed sectors of the populace influenced him subtley.

To some that might seem like a bigotted paragraph, but if you live in LA it's just a way of life. The social goal that the majority of immigrant circles push forth is segregation. We'll do our thing, you do yours, stay the hell out of our way. They have no idea what "being an American" means.

...Watto is an Armenian. True blue.

 

I will say this- the more I watch the PT the more I realize different aliens are stereotypes of prominent Southern California racial demographics... whether that is ultimately intentional or not depends on your point of view.

I think seeing this really depends on people watching the movie and looking for this type of thing.
If you watch the movies with a pre-conceved idea, then that's what you're going to see.

For a disturbing way to test this, watch the movies again with the idea that Jar-Jar is a dark Jedi who is subtly manipulating events, and that he is pulling Palpatines strings. It changes the whole feel of the movie, and even makes you interpret Jar-Jar's actions and expressions diffrently.

 

I think seeing this really depends on people watching the movie and looking for this type of thing.
If you watch the movies with a pre-conceved idea, then that's what you're going to see.


I'm not talking about subjective viewing, however. I'm talking about what's there in the script. These characters have specific traits that line up with cultural stereotypes. Lucas draws his inspirations from a myriad of sources, two of which being his life experience and Flash Gordon serials (which were inherently bigotted). I'm not saying he meant it in a racist way, but it is there.

You can't become so blinded by the bounds of PC'ness to deny the truth. Imagining Jar-Jar as a Sith Lord is creating subtext. Hearing Nute Gunray talk in a cheesy Hong Kong accent, Jar-Jar fill in for the minstrel singer, Watto's obvious Armenianess, and the fact that desert nomads (arabs) are "animals", well, that's actually in the movie.

 

Hearing Nute Gunray talk in a cheesy Hong Kong accent, Jar-Jar fill in for the minstrel singer, Watto's obvious Armenianess, and the fact that desert nomads (arabs) are "animals", well, that's actually in the movie.


No, it's not "actually in the movie". You expect it, or you look for it, so you see it there.
I work with arabic people, and I see no similarity betwen them and the Tusken Raiders.
I have many aisian friends, some from Hong Kong, and none of them sound like a Nemodian.

You're thoughts and opinions are playing a part in the way you perceive the characters. It's exactly like the Jar-Jar sith lord idea, but more subliminal.

 

I am a Japanese-American. And if you can't see what's right there, in the movie, rooted in real world stereotypes, then you are naive. Knowing three or four minorities is not the same as living in the most diverse city in the world (which I do- remember that it was a city Lucas lived in, learned in, and ultimately fled with Francis Ford Coppola for the pastures of NoCal). When you have some real life experience, then I'm sure you'll eventually understand, but until then, I ask that you refrain from attempting to chalk my opinions up to subjectivity. I am impartial on the matter, and that's why I can see it for what it is.

You are too caught up defending SW to see that I'm not attacking it- merely offering insight into the obvious real world origins of these fantasy characters.

strilo edit: This post gets too close to discussing the posters. Please keep your comments on the films.

 

I think some people are reading a bit too much into this line.

 

i think saying tusken raiders are arabs is no more logical than saying arabs are tusken raiders.

this is a piece of fiction, not allegory.

 

Hearing Nute Gunray talk in a cheesy Hong Kong accent, Jar-Jar fill in for the minstrel singer, Watto's obvious Armenianess, and the fact that desert nomads (arabs) are "animals", well, that's actually in the movie.

If you can't acknowledge that you're imprinting your own preconceived notions of racial stereotypes onto an imaginary work of science fiction, you're being unreasonable. Where in the movie does it say Watto is representative of Armenians, or that Jar Jar should be read as an African-American. If you choose to interpret the film in this light, that's up to you. However, to say that such racial analogues are an explicit part of The Phantom Menace is a baseless accusation that, in my opinion, is simply untrue.

 

this is a piece of fiction, not allegory.

Yes, it is fiction- but with a deliberate, intentional mythic structure. Myth, by definition, is allegorical. Lucas has crafted the prequels in such a way that they reflect the rise and fall of Democratic society- which in essence is a history lesson in 20th century politics and economics.

Again, I'm not stating that the intentions on the part of the filmmakers, Lucas included, were malicious in the least. I think if anything, the inclusion of such characteristics breathes life into the story. But the fact of the matter is that at the core of every stereotype, be it cultural or social, is a healthy grain of truth. These grains are dressed up in costumes and alien makeup, but they are fundamentally the same demographics that we find in the real world- and in the most diverse city in the world, where they all come in contact, it is even more apparent.

In the case of the Neimodians or the Jar-Jar "minstrel" reference, remember that Lucas is heavily influenced by Flash Gordon serials....have you ever seen one? I have, and they are most definitely racist in content and portrayal of minorities. But that doesn't make Lucas racist. Likewise, the end of ANH is a shot for shot homage to Triumph of the Will, one of the most overtly racist films ever made. But does that mean Lucas is racist? No, but it does open him up to criticism from those who recognize the subject material. In the same way you might be hesitant to cite David Duke in a Cultural Diversity report (regardless of the quote), Lucas should have known better in this instance. But that does not make it wrong or evil. You need to realize that there is no right and wrong in this matter. There's what is, and what is not. You have valid arguments, and I do repect them, but that does not make them right. Similarly, I have a valid argument- but you don't have to accept it. Time and education will ultimately refine all of our stances and we'll most likely all end up in the middle somewhere.


"i think saying tusken raiders are arabs is no more logical than saying arabs are tusken raiders."

Look at the old Harryhausen Sinbad films. Arabs (except for the white leads)are portayed in a barbarian light not too far removed from the Tuskens. Again, this is one of Lucas' influences, and I'm not implying that it was a malicious attempt. These things have a way of distilling themselves over the generations in a way that the true origins become obscured. I'm merely trying to shed light on that fact.

Love to all. One world. Word.

 

OK, let's back off on the personal comments like "naive" and "unreasonable".

 

lOVE THE LINE.
and no hes not a racist, they(ppl in the sw universe) dont get all bent out of shape like our PC culture does. SAD!

 

Getting back to the original topic of this thread, I agree with others that issues of racism, or speciesism, perhaps, are vastly different in the GFFA. Watto doesn't seem to take any offense at Qui-Gon's remark.

OK, let's back off on the personal comments like "naive" and "unreasonable".

My bad, D-S. Apologies to SithedMyPants if I gave offense. At least I didn't call him "my blue-skinned friend", right?

 

Holy crap it's Chyren!!!!