Toronto Return of the King disappointment? ( may contain spoilers)

Hey all!

I just got back from seeing return of the king, and safe to say i was not impressed... i thought the movie could have been done much better and that the second movie was far superior.

The explinations seemed lost in alot of this movie and alot of crucial elements were left out that should have in my opinion be added.

Did anyone feel the same? or did everyone else love it and i'm just crazy?

 

I would say you are crazy

I'd also say though I didn't love it. Mind you I didn't get totally overwhelmed and gaga over any of the films. I really think my days of being into the fantasy realm ended with high school.

I still enjoy it from time to time, but certainly not as big a factor as it used to be for me.

If we are gong to list disappointments then I would say I wanted more a grand entrance for the first time we see Aragorn wearing the white tree. That should have almost as significant as when he took up the sword.

Probably in the extended version.

Overall I thought it was well done, the battles were on a scale that I don't anyone ever has attempted before and they pulled it off in a convincing way.

I'll probably have more thought after seeing it again.

 

Wolf I completely disagree with your opinion and yes you are crazy...

 

I thought the movie was amazing, you're crazy

 

I thought it was good but not brilliant.

I am disapointed in how they exlcuded some things I guess they will be on the DVD.

I also felt that it was making Frodo to be ther hero when from reading the books you feel more towards the end Sam is more the hero, that may just be me though.

The CGI was really good although did feel some bits of it could do with more work on it. But that may just be the multimedia student in me being picky

 

I actually liked it better than any of the other films to be quite honest. to me, this is Peter Jackson's redemption.

but I have to admit, I cannot wait to see the extended version... anyone here attended the trilogy tuesday it was supose to be the extended version shown with it?

 

Yes, movie was awesome...you are crazy

 

I am sitting on the fence with this right now, on one hand, I loved it, it was great, I wish I was watching it right now, on the other hand, I have a few rants to get of my chest

Gets up on soap box

To me, the entire movie felt rushed, I felt that some real essential scenes were cut, for no appearant reason. The scenes involving Sauroman and Grima, The houses of Healing, I know the houses of healing scene was only about 7 minutes, I really don't think anyone in the theatre would have minded the movie running just a couple minutes more. Peter Jackson said that it was nessacary becuase the movie had strayed from Frodo long enough..This coming from the man that had to take up a couple of minutes of movie time just to show Legolas slaying a single Oliphant, in a very flashy manner of course. No, sorry, just that just doesn't work for me.

Denethor I admit that I have not read the books straight through, but I have read and learned enough to get by...and then some and I was really disappointed, There was no transistion for this character, He went from being a crazy old man...to an Old *Crazier* old man. On the other hand, it does give you a glimpse of Faramirs Motivation, with his farther telling him that it should have been him that should have died instead of Boromir. And what was with his death? That was just...weird, for lack of a better word.

Pelannor Fields Was a slight let down for me, It was good, but it didn't live up to my expectations. Some things stood out for me. Was I only the one that thought of Return of the Jedi right before Theodens death?

Eowyn: I must save you!

Theoden: You already have...

Sound familar?

It really didn't seem that long...even though I think it was close to an hour, It was really just over once the Army of the Dead showed up.

By the end of the Movie, I had just become really fed up with Frodo, I can understand that caring the ring is a huge Burden, but I did not feel any sympathy for him at all. If anything I was rooting on sam, He was the only one keeping them going, If it wasn't for him, Frodo would have been spider chow. One thing that bothered me was that Bilbo had the ring for 60 odd years, and while he was tempted, he was able to leave it behind in Fellowship Yet when Frodo is standing right over the fires of Mount doom, After coming all that way, and making so sacrfices, decides to then Give into the ring, and keep it.

For now, those are the only things that I didn't like, but there were alot of things that I did enjoy, don't get me wrong, I don't think I have ever smiled or laughed so much in a move before, True, in some parts I was the only one laughing...

Things that I did like

Arwens Vision Hate Arwen, but you had to admit, that was the cutest little kid ever.

The Charge of Rohirrim Those scenes were abseloutely amazing, the way it was filmed combined with the sound of all those pounding hooves as they charged...gave me goosebumps.

The fall of the Black Gates That was just so satisfying to watch, after seeing what everyone had endured to come to this point, to see there efforts finally rewarded was fantastic.


Thats all I can think of for now, but I'm sure I will be back later





Uilmuteiz I attended Tuesday Triloghy, The first two films were the extended versions, Return of the King was the regular cut.

 

I thought it was an excellent movie.

Although I'm certainly sympathetic to Chris Lee's parts being cut.

The secondary villian didn't really get his just deserts, nor Wormtounge.

Hopefully the exteneded versions will show more of this.

Other then that, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Can Pippin sing or what?

 

I am re reading the ending at the moment and on reflection I think the ending of the movie is actually a let down

 

Regarding the power of the Ring.

Bilbo was able to survive its influence for so long because Sauron was still in hiding and the power was diminished.

Certainly the longer you were in possesion of it the worse it was. Witness what happened to Smeagol and Bilbo's reaction in Rivendell.

Not only was Frodo carrying the Ring while Sauron was active, he was right in his territory. The power of the Ring was very strong. Stronger than anyone could probably bear. Boromir failed, even Gandalf and Galadriel were in fear of being exposed to it for long.

I could go on, but frankly the book made it clear that Frodo was undertaking the most extreme hardship with every step towards Mount Doom, and I feel the movie captured that feeling.

 

Was I only the one that thought of Return of the Jedi right before Theodens death?

Actually I thought the very same. And Legolas's little trick on the under carrage of the Oliphuant screamed to me EMPIRE!!! I kept thinking of Mark Hammil under the walker.

"That one only counts as one!"

I absolutely adored the treatment of Sam. As my name suggests i have taken a rather fond liking to him. I try to be like him as much as possible. Some here suggest i am but I feel like I fall way short. I mean he fought a giant spider to the point where it coward and wimpered away. Then he took on an entire tower of Orcs, taking them out One by One.

"This is for Frodo. This is for the Shire. And THIS....this is for me old Gaffer!"

He becomes the only ring bearer to not be fully corrupted by the ring. Though he is tempted his loyalty to Frodo is stronger (what a beautiful thought) and he knows his duty is to the journey. Even on the brink of Death where neither can stand to save their life and Sam holds Frodo speaking of the Shire, and as Frodo Loses all hope and memory of the things he once loved the most, Sam picks up Frodo and carries him up the side of the mountain.

My favorite had to have been the bit after the ring was destroyed as Frodo recalls the Shire and Sam thinks of the one thing that means most to him...Rosie Cotton, and how he thinks he will never see her again. The transition from nervous bashful Hobbit, to fearless loyal friend was great...what I am refering to was when he stood up and approached Rosie. It was beautiful.

I couldn't think of a better way to end the movie.

It was wonderful to watch the people of middle earth bowing to the hobbits, the brave little souls who proved their worth and skill when it mattered most. The beings that carried the journey on their small shoulders.

It was wonderful to see the journey come full circle.

I can't wait to see it again.

 

it seemed to depend a LOT on the extended edition making up for plot holes...

this just isn't acceptable to me... Cutting out Chris Lee just did not seem right, and i did think it actually detracted from the plot, the agrument that it would screw up the pace is bull because lets look at all the other long slow parts, a fast action squence with the tension that that confrintation would have would have been great.

Aragorn just shows up on the boat? What was that unless i fell asleep the last time i saw him he was talking to a dead guy in a far away place. But ok he appears on a boat with Gimili and Legs for no apparent reason.

Again they seemed to have left out Faramirs character development, by the end of the movie we still have no idea of his importance, and we really have no idea why Gandalf even was trying to hard to save him.

What i found very different with this film was that things were rushed and not explained really. Even in the long talking parts! We have no idea why the three elf ring barrers are there! or why Frodo and Bilbo have to go with.

 

was I the only one who thought of the Flinstones when Legolas came sliding down that Oliphant?

When Frodo gets stung by Sheelob
*frodo thinks* not again....!

As for the ghost appearing out of nowhere.. well:

-Gandalf tells Aragorn to come by the river in Edoras

-Elrond when he gives him the sword.

but I do agree they should have shown the Minas Tirith troops despair at the arrival of the ships.

 

was I the only one who thought of the Flinstones when Legolas came sliding down that Oliphant?


Nope!

but I do agree they should have shown the Minas Tirith troops despair at the arrival of the ships.

Thats true, but at that point they had there hands full with the attack coming at them from the front, I don't even think they really noticed.

That was one of the coolest scenes in the movie I thought, when Aragorn heads towards the Orcs as they taunt him, and then the Army of the dead comes spilling out from behind him, that was incredible!

 

Saw the movie, loved it, but still preferred the book (but then I almost always do). I saw a convention showing (with House Rules, thank goodness) but not the midnight screening because I had work the next morning.

It was not a bad movie, but because alot of key scenes had to be cut out in order to make it more screenworthy, it really felt a bit rushed at times. I'm hoping that the extended edition will take care of most of this.

Sabrina

 

Just saw it. There weren't things that I disliked, but at some points the sparkle just wasn't there for me. Having said that, I loved it.

One thing that bothered me was that Bilbo had the ring for 60 odd years, and while he was tempted, he was able to leave it behind in Fellowship Yet when Frodo is standing right over the fires of Mount doom, After coming all that way, and making so sacrfices, decides to then Give into the ring, and keep it.

Couple of things here.

(1) Bilbo NEVER used the ring after his adventure until the party, so it didn't have as much corrupting power on him as it did on Frodo.

(2) A long time does pass while the ring is in Frodo's possession - 17 years before he even sets out on the journey!

(3) Frodo was taking the ring against its will and the ring was making it extremely difficult. It was a much heavier physical and mental burden than it ever was for Bilbo.

(4) This shows completely the true power of the ring. If he had just tossed it in it would basically be undoing everything the ring has been built up to be.

(5) Again, what Woofer stated beautifully, that Bilbo had the ring when Sauron was diminished and didn't even know about the Shire or Hobbits; Frodo had it while he was raging. And he was walking right into the Lion's den.

He becomes the only ring bearer to not be fully corrupted by the ring.

I wouldn't say that Bilbo was corrupted, corrupted meaning able to let it go.

What i found very different with this film was that things were rushed and not explained really. Even in the long talking parts! We have no idea why the three elf ring barrers are there! or why Frodo and Bilbo have to go with.

From the novel, Frodo and Bilbo don't have to go with at all. As to why they choose to go, Frodo's speech at the end explains the psychology of it a little bit. And it was said that this was the last ship. All of the other elves who are going have gone (well, Leggs and Gimli do go later), and naturally those who are important will stay until the end. "The time of the elves is over."

Some things that I particularly loved:

- Faramir seeing Pippin for the first time
- Faramir's character continuing to redeem itself like in TTTE.
- Eowyn's "I am no man" line.
- Frodo's "wounds not healing" speech. beautifully gone
- Frodo's deterioration and Sam's character development was honestly spectacular
- beacons "Then Rohan will answer!"
- Pip's singing

Didn't like:
- fact that they left out the house of healing.
- lack of Saruman stuff (but I already spazzed about that).

 

i as well disliked the fact that the HOH were left out, I too felt the movie was a bit rushed. From the begining of the movie till the siege of Minas Tirith i felt the performances and the plot was really rushed. As well i felt there was not much build up for the initial siege. Yes it was kinda cool to see the trebuchets moving forward but i was not as in to this battle as i was Helms Deep. At least there we saw the preperations and all, not just the leader of the army running out and telling everyone to prepare. But i have to say once the riders of Rohan showed up the movie finally got good. From that point on i felt the movie was great and was some of my favourite LOTR

 

Rushed? Wasn't it 3 and a half hours...they had aalot to show after all...

 

that is true, thats why the EE should be even better, i know it was 3 1/2 hours but that was the feeling i got at the BEGINNING, the rest of the movie was without a doubt the best part of LOTR

 

Just came back from the film.

Peter Jackson is the king.
Did any of you watch the Ralph Bakshi version when it played on Space last weekend? Do you know how bad it could have been? Any of it? All of it?

Peter, along with cast and crew, have created a truly beautiful piece of cinema. They've pushed the bar in terms of how films can and could be. They've shown us what DVD box sets should be like. They've created a remarkable work of art.

God help Pete, because it's quite possible that he will never in his life be able to top the achievement he's made with the Lord of the Rings films.

--

...as for RotK - I await the extended edition which is the real version of the film, but I got my $13 worth and then some.

 

I'm sure if Pete is such a good director he will be able to create something that is at par with Lord of the Rings.

Forgive me for saying this but Jackson LOTR handed to him, he didn't write the script he was given a great story and he changed it into great movies, but their were probably a ton of directors that could have done just as good a job as he did.

The true test of a director in my opinion is taking an original screenplay and adapting that to the big screen.

 

Just saw it....

Fantastic movie.....but how I *loathe* hobbits.....

Could have been a lot better without them all.

*ducks*

 

I saw it yesterday and enjoyed it. I felt it was better than TTT mainly because it had a purpose. My problem with TTT book or movie is that nobody gets anywhere, its just a big circle.

As for this movie. My main beef would be with another sad, and ridiculous Legola trick - you try fighting on the hind quarters of an oliphant - go ahead, I dare you - why don't movie makers try as well - then maybe we wouldn't see people do it - or at least make it look real (we just crazy glued his feet....) - then taking it down with an arrow? the beasts skull would be almost as thick as the arrow!

I didn't miss Dooku, i mean Saurman at all, it was explained that he was hiding in the tower, therefore, his purpose was finished. We didn't need to see him anymore.

Gollum didn't work as well either, the pool conversation was odd (My love?) And the way Frodo kept forgiving him every time Gollum tried killing him - deluded?

Other than Eowyn being able to cut the hellbeast head off in two cuts - I liked the scene with here at the witchking (except his silly helmet)

Hated Sam's 'I cant carry your burden, but I sure can carry you!!!' line - could he not have just picked him up - no preamble?

Aragorn and the boat - Wolf wasn't listening - Aragorn was told that the boats were heading to Minas tirth, so it makes sence that he and his army of evil dead head them off and arrive that way, and the entrance was cheesy but cool.

Now was I the only one that found Legola and Gimili to be nothing but comedic relief in this movie?

Another thing Wolf said that bugs me - about being handed a great story being easy to turn into a great movie - You obviously never read League of Extraordinary Gentlemen then did you? Turning books into movies is way more difficult than turning a screenplay into a movie. To keep true to the book, you need to attempt to realized the setting, characters, and the mood. You have fans that have their own individual ideas of each of those factors. You have a set amount of time (2-3hours) to tell it. You have to decide what parts will make the cut, which characters to keep, which to loose, which to combine. Not everyone gets as free a rein as Jackson did, and he still needed to seriously trim things. and he did a damn good job. As for adapting a screenplay - childs play. - but hes done it well too - Frighteners

So, as an end to the trilogy, I'm satisfied. Would have altered a few things Jackson did but doubt anyone could have done better.

 

Turning books into movies is way more difficult than turning a screenplay into a movie.

I absolutely agree. There is a great deal more to live up to when the material already exists.

Fantastic movie.....but how I *loathe* hobbits.....

Throws a cat in your general direction