Lit SOD: Save Our Darth - Darth Vader

Well, sure, you're absolutely right... but it's just that I think that kind of thing should be super rare.

I mean, like you say, we've already got Palpatine... so that Starkiller would then be born -- and discovered -- within a few generations of him just seems kind of... too big of a coincidence.

Though, then, again -- as Canderous would say -- "we're talking about the Force, here". And it basically exists to justify this kind of thing.

 

The Force creates Anakin to oppose Sidious, Starkiller to form the Rebellion, and Luke to redeem Vader all to dump Palpatine down a shaft.

That's extremely passive aggressive for a universal energy field.

Oh well, better than the Mareks are Revans descendants.



Edit:

Of course, with the "Tay Vanis and Chessmaster Vader" we could argue Vader wanted the Rebellion to begin since his plan was to undermine the Emperor so he could accumulate more power in a mostly-cowed galaxy. Which, of course, succeeded by his promotion after the Death Star's destruction. To Starkiller's credit, there's also the fact he seeks out Kota to learn about the Jedi immediately after the FIRST betrayal--which means he wasn't just following Vader's script.

 

I don't know. Given how poor a job Vader did of breaking Starkiller to the dark side (and given we know how good a job he can do when he wants: see TFUII's Dark!Rhett) my preferred interpretation is that Vader intentionally engineered a situation where a "light side" Rhett would throw himself at the Emperor, so as to gauge his master's strength in a straight up fight without any obvious betrayal of his own.

Because that way I can pretend assert that he threw the final fight in TFU.

It's not like Vader doesn't want Palpatine to underestimate him, after all.

...

But, then, I also like to think that Juno Eclipse is actually Shira Brie in blonde wig and Vader's true apprentice. So. Y'know.

 

Yeah, we all have our theories.

Mine is just that Rhett is THAT motivated and Vader DEEPLY underestimates his apprentice. Replaying the game, it's kind of hilarious how there's a subtle undercurrent of Vader treating Marek like a moron and how DEEPLY the latter resents it.

It's kind of hilarious given that's a double of Obi Wan and Anakin. Starkiller just is better at keeping his mouth shut.

But yes, TWUE WUV can give a Jedi the power to defeat anyone!

 

Journey was before my time but you get points for that

 

Journey transcends time. They weren't before your time, your times just haven't intersected.

 

Or Vader is as deeply conflicted about killing Starkiller as he was Luke, or near that level of conflict. Even before tossing him out the window he had to think about it, and even then he knew he wasn't really killing him and it was part of the plan to get him to form the Rebel Alliance.

 

So before, now, and ongoing ? Maybe I'll have to take a listen

 

Find their Greatest Hits album that was released in '88, it has all of their classic songs. Well worth a listen.

On topic, do you think Vader has a music system built into his suit? He has to use all of those switches on his suit for something...

 

Didn't you know the Imperial March is actually not part of the soundtrack but comes from Vader's inbuilt micro stereos

 

He did in the Robot Chicken special

 

It is better than Lost Command. There are some epic scenes that add to Vader's character, like the "Never suffer rivals" line and his disassociating himself with Anakin Skywalker. Also, Moff Trachta is an amazing character. I like the art and setting, and even the concept of a secret prison. That said, the story has more plotholes than swiss cheese.

For example, why would two Sith Lords and an entire army of Dark Jedi be needed to take down a small group of imperial cadets? (Not even stormtroopers or rebel alliance members.) Why would Darth Vader be so eager to take the emperor to a medical facility instead of killing him? Why would the Jedi record themselves talking about their omg secrets? Why does everyone know about the Death Star (A secret project)? Also, the phrase "Thank the maker" should really be used by droids only, because if not that implies that droids and humans are made by the same deity. These reasons and many, many more are why I just couldn't rank it as high as the original force unleashed. (Although it is definitely unfair to compare it to lost command and FU2.)

 

Just like how Lost Command isn't the only work to show Vader surviving without his mask, Ghost Prison's hardly the only work to show Vader saving the Emperor when his greatest goal is to supposedly kill the man.

 

I'm not sure how much conflict Vader would have about fighting Starkiller. I will say, TFU2 does a decent job of establishing Vader is suffering a weird kind of nervous breakdown regarding Juno and Starkiller. Almost everything he says about her could apply to his struggle with his love for Padme.

Oh yeah, Vader has to save the Emperor because the Dark Lord is the only one he has left. Even if he hates him.

TIE Fighter
Return of the Jedi's Throne Room Sequence
Grand Moff Tracta's conspiracy
Vader is on the Death Star to protect the Emperor's interests from Tarkin

Vader wants the Emperor dead but at his hands and only when he's ready to prove himself stronger.

 

[double post]

 

Yeah,

Having played TFU2 I'm now of the mind that Vader threw the first fight with Starkiller. Darth Vader gets up, armor busted and all, looking pretty okay and not at all upset with the fact the Rebellion got away. I'm inclined to believe Vader thought Starkiller wouldn't kill him (and was right)--banking on their relationship.

Which, honestly, is rather dumb since Galen hates him by this point.

Still, if we assume he's intending to get Galen "dead" so he can later revive him/brainwipe him/use him as experiment fodder for his Clone Sith Army--that's a masterful plan. It also puts him in a prime position to consolidate his control over the Imperial military. As long as the Rebellion exists, Darth Vader is needed by the Empire.

Also, in TFU2, Darth Vader is RIDICULOUSLY more powerful. He's more or less immune to everything Galen throws at him and is playing with him the entire time. Galan hits him with everything he's got and for the entire first part of the fight--Vader is mostly just shrugging it off. It's all just theatre until Darth Vader leads Galen to Juno Eclipse and basically says that he's going to kill her unless his servant kills Koto.

Then Juno ****s it up by getting Vader ticked off enough he accidentally "kills her."

That's when Galen fully embraces the power of the Dark Side. In a stunning display of gameplay and story integration, Darth Vader isn't suffering anything but TINY bits of "red" damage (instead suffering yellow "fatigue" damage) during the first fight. Only when Galen thinks Vader has murdered Juno does he actually start inflicting real damage on Vader. Even then, it's a huge fight between them.

A fight, I remind you where the "playing" part involved hurling 2000 ton metal circles and platforms at Starkiller. It's also clear Vader isn't trying to hurt Starkiller. He keeps his rationale voice the entire time and tries to recover the situation. It's kind of dumb but Vader keeps saying Starkiller needs to rise above his love of Juno and weakness for her--being the most fatherly and mentoring he's ever been.

It's like it's a bonding moment to them.

Starkiller only "wins" when he supplements his Force Lightning with Kamino's massive storm system. One million gigawatts power. Galen is WAY-WAY outclassed in this battle but I give him the victory. A victory, of course, we know that Vader is entirely in control of due to the hidden presence of Dark Starkiller.

(I don't think he's out of nowhere, though. Vader has hundreds of Starkiller clones you murder throughout the game).

Vader Playing Around



When the Fight Gets Serious

 

I've never once gotten the impression that Vader threw the fight on the Death Star. Looks more like Galen beating him fair and square.

In TFU2 however the fact he was able to tank numerous blasts of Force Lightning doesn't make sense in any context. With the possible existence of the Dark Apprentice and the Distant Thunder scenes its very possible he threw that fight.

 

I think Vader intended to kill Juno all along -- in the novelization, he orders his stormtroopers to execute her long before he tosses her. Using her life to gain compliance from Starkiller isn't going to work forever, but he probably figures that he can at least use her to get Starkiller to kill Kota and maybe the Rebel leadership, and once Starkiller has done that, Starkiller will have lost Juno in the same way he lost Padme before she died. Maybe it does throw a wrench in that plan by killing her so soon, before Starkiller gets his hands dirty and re-establishes himself in the role of Vader's enforcer, but Vader mostly seemed to be improvising on the spot during the middle of a battle.

 

Your eyes can deceive you. Don't trust them.

 

Twice?

 

Splinter of the minds Eye has Obi-Wan possess Luke. Seriously, it's in the original novel.

 

This was the quote in question:

p284-285:

His voice held an unaccustomed hint of conviction. "I'm going to kill you, Darth Vader."
That humorless laugh again. "What a high opinion you hold of yourself, Skywalker."
"I'm ... I'm Ben Kenobi," Luke whispered in an odd way.
For just a moment Vader seemed shaken. "Ben Kenobi's dead. I killed him myself. You are simple Luke Skywalker, an ex-farmboy from Tatooine. You are no master of the Force and the equal of Ben Kenobi you will never be."
"Ben Kenobi is with me, Vader," Luke snarled, gaining confidence every second, "and the Force is with me too."
"You do have something of the Force about you, boy," Vader admitted. "A master of it you are not, however. That dooms you. Only a master could do ... this."
The Dark Lord lunged and Luke spun well clear. At the same time, Vader was staring not at Luke, but at the ground. A small fragment of the fallen ceiling rose, shot straight for Luke's head. Seeing it coming, he reacted as Kenobi had taught him ... without thinking.
A much smaller stone lifted and intersected the path of the charging rock. The two met. Though Vader's missile was by far the larger, it was deflected by Luke's rock to send it shooting past his shoulder.
Panting, he stared challengingly back at Vader. "Good, boy," the Dark Lord confessed, "very good. But my stone was the heavier. My powers are the stronger."

 

Vader seems to be compensating for something.

 

I think Splinter of Mind's Eye, it was only that one line that indicated being possessed. (Like the plot would have went in the direction of all Luke's accomplishments being Ben's, as this was written before ESB.) It's pretty hilariously messed up- the idea that the Jedi would have a sith-like body snatching technique.

I think Obi-wan still can beat Vader after 20 years. If only that it's heavily implied in ANH that Obi-wan threw the fight on purpose. If Obi-wan knew he would lose no matter what happened, why not just fight at full strength until the end? Obi-wan's real problem is that he can't defeat the emperor, only the twins could do that.