Characters The Conference Room (A Jaina and Jag Discussion Thread) FOTJ: OMEN now out - what's next for J/J?

That's because he was created to be Jaina's love interest. I don't think there can be any debate about that because it's true. The debate should be about if he's a good enough character to stand on his own or if he's always going to be just Jaina's sidekick/boyfriend/whatever.

 

i think he is. I mean they HAVE built up his character more and more over time. I think a Jag book might be possible, but only after all this J/J drama is over. Still, look at how long they took to make a Zekk standalone book and he had the whole 'shadow academy' thingy to make him interseting along with all the drama with the kiliks (but honestly Jag could have a cool story to tell during the crisis too). After that he just became Jaina's sidekick.

 

Jag is cool enough to stand alone. But that's not the point. He's Jaina's better half, but that doens't mean he has to be reduced to the position of a "sidekick." Zekk was a sidekick. Jag could never fill the sidekick role. He's to awesome.

In a way, he's kind of like Han Solo. There's no doubt Han is a great character, with deep complexities. But he and Leia make a better TEAM than either of them could ever be apart. Just think of what Jaina says about them in Invincible---sorry, I don't have the book with me. She wants to be like them, be a team like they are, have someone the way her mother has Han. Just because they're a team doesn't diminish their indiviual selves at all.

It's not JUST that Jag needs Jaina; Jaina needs Jag, too. Every time she gets screwed up, it's his logic, or his support (or both) that gets her back on track. Likewise, Jaina is sort of an anchor for Jag, someone who pushes him to be MORE than a Chiss. He was never meant to stay on Csilla. He won't become her sidekick. He can't, if he's going to become Emperor. The galaxy will see HER as second to HIM. But together, they'll make something incredible: an iron fist.

Once they learn to sort out their problems. Or, like, TALK.

The reason I'm excited about Zekk's novel is because he's been such an underdeveloped character for so long. It's going to be exhilerating seeing what Cunningham does with him. With his background, he's bound to become an awesome character, but so far he's been widely ignored by the authors for uses other than romantic tension and humor. As for a Jag stand-alone, they authors could probably pick any moment from their break-up to Exile. There is bound to be some mention of Jaina, but that's unavoidable. Their lives are undeniably entwined. As long as they have an ending we're rooting for, Jag's life will be dependent on Jaina's, and vice versa. She just likes to ignore her problem, whereas he can agknowledge his. Just because they're together, doesn't make them any less of characters. In fact, in my opinion, it makes them MORE.

 

QFT. I've re-read parts of Inferno, Fury, Invincible and Revelation--all 3 authors--in the last week or so. Scattered throughout all of them are hints and suggestions that the Jaina/Jag issue is either resolved or about the be resolved. Other than about 2 annoying lines from Denning in Invincible, the thing is resolved and for all 3 authors to have written it in the same drive-us-insane way, it came down from the powers that be. For all that there was a supposed love "triangle," I never actually saw, in the text, that Jaina was actually interested in/attracted to Zekk. In the first J/J/Z scene in Exile, Jaina acknowledges that she's still attracted to Jag. It's a bad idea, but she considers it briefly.

I suspect FOTJ is going to open with the two of them in some not married but together limbo.

Zekk will always be a sidekick to Jaina. She's such a strong personality and their dynamic is such that Zekk is actually weaker with her. The guy has an inferiority complex, and I suspect he is forever trying to make it up to her for leaving her on Hapes. I think she's long since let it go, but he won't.

Written well, Zekk could carry a lighter story on his own, and the post NJO universe is sorely lacking in a younger supporting cast. It's at the point where it limits storytelling. I liked Dark Journey enough to invest $8 and a couple of hours to see what they come up with.

That said, when J&J are good together, they're really good. The academy scene on Ossus (I just read it again this week) was terrific teamwork. He jumped on her plan in that meeting at the start of Invincible and ran with it. It's actually their personal issues that get in the way. I think Jaina is actually better off after LOTF. She's spent decades trying to figure out the Sword of the Jedi thing. Although it was bad, she knows now, and there isn't much worse she can be called upon to do. For her, that's probably actually a relief (it's the text at the very end of Invincible).

 

She's such a strong personality and their dynamic is such that Zekk is actually weaker with her.

That stuck out to me. After YJK, he's such a nancy-boy. He follows her around love-sick and has no other personality.

 

sorry, you mentioned the academy scene and I had a total flashback to the beginning in invincible, and everyones in that confrence room, and Jaina makes eye contact with Jag and he grins at her.

yep, that's true. It always seemed to me he (zekk) was kinda trying to FORCE himself at Jaina.

And if they DO open up with Jaina and Jag TOGETHER and not MARRIED, i'll be okay with it. As long as they aren't totally ignoring the fact that they're meant to be together.

 

At least both of them will play a good part in Fate of the Jedi. I suspect Jag is going to really be comforting Jaina. She will need him more than ever especially after what happened in Invincible.

 

Let's not forget: FOTJ takes place two years after LOTF.

I loved that scene! I spent months envisioning Jag and Jaina's reunion, and Denning does it in one sentence. I don't know how Jaina can resist a grin from Jagged Fel. That has to be lethal. It was even better that he was sitting with her parents. You know who they'd side with. I also loved the part when Han decides to throw caution (and Luke's orders) to the wind, and Jag is the first person he turns to in order to help Jaina. Genius!

FOTJ could land anywhere on their relationship. They might be TOGETHER at the beginning and married at the end. Or thye could be married in the middle. Or they could be talking about marriage in the beginning, and actually married by the second book. Or they could be married at the beginning. Or they might not get married at all!

But I think that marriage will always be involved to some degree when talking about Jag and Jaina. It's a logical step for both of them, at some point. For Jaina, it's just a matter of when. Jag's upbringing causes him to see Jaina as the mother of his "line," his dynasty, so to speak. He says so in Fury. So I think the subject of marriage will always be in the background for them. It's not just a fantasy rabid fangirls entertain until all hours of the night.

It's weird, because so much stand in their way, but so much DOESN'T. They make a terrific team, they love each other, they can work together, they listen to each other's ideas, and they both excpect marriage. It's just...they miscommunicate sometimes. They make assumptions when they should be talking things out.

 

I've always wanted to see someone do something with this. To a great extent, children model marriages on their parents, whether they're an example of what to do or not to do. At the end of TUF (I think) Jaina makes reference to wanting what her parents have. Both J&J were raised by parents who had a "Great Love Story." I think they would both take marriage very seriously. I could almost see Jag dragging Jaina to the GFFA version of the altar ASAP just so she'd stick around long enough for them to sort their issues out.

 

I don't think she'd let him drag her that far so quickly I'm curious about where they'll be, but all the guesses seem equally possible.

 

That's a good image - I can see Jag dragging her along, and I can see Jaina being difficult, pouting when she has to say "I do." It's funny, to me.

I suppose the fact that both of their parents have a "Great Love Story" puts pressure on them both. It's the reason Jaina started breaking away from Jag in TUF. But it gives me hope, because that means we're due for some kind of big moments between them, not the subtle stuff the authors have been using. Don't get me wrong, I love the subtle stuff. But these are the children of Han and Leia, and Soontir and Syal. They're trying to be cool and casual about their feelings, but that never worked for their parents. It's bound to blow up in their faces. And it's bound to be glorious. I think that we're approaching a spot opportune for this to happen - with Jag approaching the role of Emperor (even as Grand Moff). Their circumstances are reaching epic proportions, and they'll have to deal with the consequences sooner or later.

Once they finally get married, things will be so muc easier. I'm not saying that marriage in itself will be easy for them - it won't be. But at least neither of them will be running from their feelings anymore.

 

22 days left. I should be more excited about this. But we haven't really been given that much information. Remember when DN came out? There was this whole press conference at C3 and everything. They gave us loads of teasers. Now what? One advertisement?

And I'd like to know... On the cover for MF, why is an IMPERIAL STAR DESTROYER shooting at the Millennium Falcon? And why is Jag condoning it?

 

Well Imperial-class Star Destroyers are common in GA so it doesn't mean it has to be Imperial Remnant ship. The bigger question is why MF is not black on this picture?

 

Han would have to have a lot of free time and a lot of money if he would paint MF every 2-3 years

 

i imagine the mf white or whatever color it usually is. but that is a good point.


whew, it didn't think about how long it was. Just yesterday someone was like, 'we're in our fifth weel of school!' i had no clue. but hopefully time will pass reallllllllyyyyy quickly.

 

I preordered MF with my shiny student debit card. Don't tell my mom. I had to buy a book for my roommates birthday, so I figured I might as well preorder the book, too. Why is it that books are cheaper on the internet - sometimes even after you add shipping?

Excuse my ignorance, what "fifth wheel of school" mean?

Okay, I'm getting a little more excited.

 

haha, i meant week. i told you i've been really busy.

hmmm...i'm still debating whether or not i should buy it. i probably will...

 

Don't worry, as soon as it's out, I'll spoil you rotten!



Anyone else who wants in, just let me know.

CJM

 

Yes, spoilers, pretty pretty please. I have no patience. I read the ends of books first.

I have another random train of thought. Allston is writing the first fotj book. Allston is a J/J-er. Golden is writing the second and she is known for writing romanc-y stories. Denning is third and he's good for crises although he did say in an interview that J/J were resolved.
I think it may be Allston who sets them up, Golden who makes it obvious and Denning who makes a crisis. It remains to be seen at what point in the 9 books this happens.

I need to get a life.

 

Was that Denning interview after Invincible?

This thread would explode if Troy would mess up J/J again

 

Denning! I love him, honestly I do, but I'm afraid he's going to end with some sort of cliffhanger AGAIN. Who's going missing this time? Will it be Luke? Since Denning is the third author, that means he's ending the series.

Which is good...from a certain POV. The way he ends books, he sets things up for more series, for more complex building. Let's just hope tragedy doesn't touch Jag and Jaina this time (much).

If you put spoilers on here, remember to hide them. I don't want to read spoilers. I have a friend who reads the ends of books first. She did it when I got Invincible, and then she grinned at me, all knowingly. It was so vexing.

Anyway, Denning's cool. I love listening to his interveiws. He's such a gentleman. I'm happy that he and Allston will be coming back again. They work well together.