Yoda or Emperor, the question is now? Or maybe Windu?

We knew that Yoda is the most powerful Jedi in movies (well Anakin should be more powerful, considering midicronians, but he wasn't.I wander why.}. We saw his excelent fighting skills in his duels against Count Dooku and Emperor. In his duel against Emperor there was no winners, and I think that Emperor has proved more powerful than him. But, on the other hand, in Emperors duel against Mace Windu, Windu won, and he could kill him if there was no Anakins interference {I always hated Anakin for this). So who is more powerful Yoda, Emperor or maybe Mace Windu?

 

We knew that Yoda is the most powerful Jedi in movies (well Anakin should be more powerful, considering midicronians, but he wasn't.I wander why.}.


No, we don't know that Yoda was the most powerful Jedi. We do know that he was the most experienced. And I find the explaination that the loss of limbs suffered on Mustafar led to Anakin being less powerful as ludicrous. He loses an arm on Geonosis and becomes even more powerful by ROTS. He loses three limbs on Mustafar and is no longer the most powerful Force user? This doesn't make any sense. I wish that Lucas had kept his mouth shut on this topic. Even James Lucerno in "The Dark Lord" hints that Anakin's loss of powerful was due his emotional and psychological funk, instead of any loss of limbs.

 

Just some friendly advice, I don't mind a misspelled word here or there, but I would appeciate it if you could clean up your grammar, your posts are difficult to read.

What you say is all opinion. I believe Mace was set up by Palpatine, and it even says that in the ROTS novel. Yoda, it seems is the most powerful Jedi in the movies and Mace seems to be the next best. But Anakin fared better against Count Dooku, but than Obiwan beat Anakin. So there is no actual way to decipher who the strongest is. I think though GL said that Palpatine is the strongest Force user in the saga, but other than that, GL never said, yoda is first, mace next, or anything like that.

 

I agree with you.That first sentence was not apropriate considering the tread. As you can see I am also confused about who is more powerful of that three persons.I asked my friends who are also Star Wars fans who is most powerful Jedi (or Sith) in movies and they all agreed that it is Yoda.Maybe this lead to my confusion, so I decided to post this topic.I just want answers, and if there is more threads like this, please do not lock it before i gain my answers.

I also think that Anakin was more powerful in his Darth Vader form.

 

I would say Master Yoda and Emperor Palpatine are equal in Force Power with Mace being a very close third, though Vapaad gives him an advantage against Dark Siders that Yoda doesn't have.

Anakin was weaker because he never reached his potential, but a fully realized Anakin or Luke(who Lucas has said has the same potential) would be more powerful than any other Jedi.

 

Sorry about grammar mistakes, but in my country there are little people who know English well.I learned French in school, and everything that I learned of English was from movies and computer.If this bothers you, than maybe you shouldn't read my posts in future.I didn't see anyone else complained.

 

Is this alright for you, LordVader66?

DarthLegion: your spelling, punctuation and grammar is perfectly legible to me. I could not even begin to write half of that in French.

 

Has it occurred to anyone that we have no idea who was the most powerful in the Force?

There is one thing to consider . . . Anakin, as far as we know, is the only Force-user to become one with the Force and maintain his consciousness without any instructions from anyone.

 

Nice, Cryogenic. I'm sure DarthLegion can stand up for himself though. For the record, I was polite about it and I don't think it was an unreasonable request. So get the hell off my back about it.

Strilo edit: Unreasonable? No. Unacceptable? Yes. And responding this way to Cryogenic is also not acceptable.

 

DarthLegion012 -- I can read you loud and clear. English is a tough language for those of us raised to read and write it. You are doing better than Master Yoda with your grammar.

Yoda fights two Sith -- Dooku, his former apprentice who he should know well, and Sidious. Both fights end in a draw due to circumstances that seem well beyond Yoda's control. We first see Mace fight on Geonosis in the arena, and then not again until his duel with Sidious. In that fight Sidious appears to fall to Mace in defeat, but on this point there is much disagreement. Many think Sidious pretends to suffer defeat after letting Mace taste the true depth of Sidious' dark powers. Once Mace senses who and what he is up against, he knows this 'darkness' must cease to exsit right here, right now! But Sidious knows Anakin is there, and that he, Sidious, has planted the seed of need in young Skywalker's mind that Padme will die without him.

So, as we say in the U.S., Sidious might just be playing Possom (a Possom plays dead to fool an attacker, then gets up and walks away when the danger has passed).

Anakin is not the most powerful without the dark side as his ally. He ambushes Mace, which allows Sidious to destroy the Jedi Master. But as Vader (or Vader-like, as when he used his rage to defeat Dooku), Anakin is a bad ***!

We neglect Obi-Wan in this discussion. He defeated Darth Maul, who killed Obi-Wan's master Qui-Gon. He defeats General Grievous, and he defeats the newly annointed Sith apprentice Darth Vader on Mustafar.

But where Yoda survives his duel with Sidious, Obi-Wan would probably not fare so well. He did not have the experience to face such a powerful dark lord.

All-in-all, when we look at the evidence, Sidious is the most powerful after Anakin is defeated on Mustafar. As the man behind the mask, Anakin/Vader is not physically powerful enough to directly confront Sidious.

Sidious is the king of the force!

 

Also keep in mind that the yoda/emporor fight in rots wasn't nessecarily even. Lucas shot it like it was, as far as sidius's ocasional facial expressions of defeat (but when he made those faces, he really wasn't defeated). With the lightsaber, they are pretty much equal, yoda might even be better. But with the force, it was clear that sidius was the superior. he was carelessly throwing chair after chair at yoda with great ease. And then yoda focuses real hard just to throw only ONE that doesn't even hit him (but he still makes that traditional badguy face of defeat). The other instance is when yoda and sidius were pushing the force lightning back and forth. They made it look like yoda was winning, but when u look at it before the blast of energy, the lightning was closer to yoda's side, so sidius was technically winning at that as well.

 

I can read you loud and clear. English is a tough language for those of us raised to read and write it. You are doing better than Master Yoda with your grammar.

Yep, anyone who complains about grammar should go after Yoda, the real grammar villian. [/b]

Yoda fights two Sith -- Dooku, his former apprentice who he should know well, and Sidious. Both fights end in a draw due to circumstances that seem well beyond Yoda's control. We first see Mace fight on Geonosis in the arena, and then not again until his duel with Sidious. In that fight Sidious appears to fall to Mace in defeat, but on this point there is much disagreement. Many think Sidious pretends to suffer defeat after letting Mace taste the true depth of Sidious' dark powers. Once Mace senses who and what he is up against, he knows this 'darkness' must cease to exsit right here, right now! But Sidious knows Anakin is there, and that he, Sidious, has planted the seed of need in young Skywalker's mind that Padme will die without him.

So, as we say in the U.S., Sidious might just be playing Possom (a Possom plays dead to fool an attacker, then gets up and walks away when the danger has passed).

Yep, IMO the end of the Mace/Sidious fight was an act for Anakins sake.

 

Well, what do you define as power? In the jedi arts, its divided into three main categories: Swordsmanship, Knowledge of the Force, and Force Potential. Its true they all act together to help the force user fight, but each character is stronger in one of the areas then he is in others. Anakin has the greatest force potential of all of them. We can all agree on that as he is the chosen one. Swordsmanship Would most likely go to Mace and Sidious. Knowledge of the Force go to Yoda and Sidious. Sure, yoda is a great swordmaster, but he has to rely on his knowledge of the force to help him gain the energy to fight. Mace is a powerful force user, but he would rely more on his skill with a saber and his knowledge of vaapad. Anakin is both a great swordsman and has great knowledge of the force, but his force potential can boost these things as the force guides him.

 

This request may be worded nice, but it is not your place to correct anyone else's grammar here, or ask them to. We have people from all over the world and many of them have some other language as their native language. As was the case here, requests like these can offend and upset other users, especially if they are still learning English and are lacking confidence in it. So in conclusion, don't post things like that again. If someone's spelling or grammar is not to your liking then don't read their posts.

 

I feel that all three are so close in overall power that it's not fair to ask who's the best. They could all beat one another depending on their situation. You must take into account how they are fighting(Lightsaber or Force or Both), the terrain they're fighting on, and overall experience. IN my opionon Mace is the best lightsaber duelist, Yoda is the most experienced force user, and Sidious is the most well rounded fighter. Obi-Wan should not even be mentioned in this thread. He's not on the same level as these three and we all know it.

 

True, but he was pulled through by Ben and Yoda as said by the Flanneled One in the RotJ commentary.

If the databank counts as evidence

"Inside the spacious interior of the Galactic Senate chambers, Yoda challenged the Emperor. The two entered into a spectacular duel -- a contest between the most powerful practitioners of the Force's light and dark sides. The Emperor proved too powerful to defeat. Though Yoda held his own for much of the duel, in the end, the Sith bested him. He realized that directly confronting the Sith would be doomed to failure. Defeated, Yoda slinked away into the shadows of the Senate chamber's cavernous depths, leaping into a waiting getaway speeder piloted by Bail Organa."

- The Yoda Entry under the movies tab

 

One of the reasons i love Star Wars is that, as in real life, there isnt any absolute ranking of warriors. Since they are using different techniques, there are some fields that are weak, and some that are strong. For example, Dooku beats easily Obi-Wan, who beats fierce attackers like Grievous and Anakin, who beats Dooku. You get my point?
Now, to the point. It seems that Mace is the strongest fighter with the lightsaber. I dont think any Jedi or Sith can beat him in sword fighting. On the other hand he is rather weak in force using comparing to Yoda or Sidious, even Obi. They are pretty equal but Sidious is using offencive techniques and Yoda defensive, so Sidious has a huge advantage in fight.
Anakin could be the strongest of them all in both aspects IF he continued normally his life, either as a Jedi or as a Sith, WITHOUT destroying himself both physically and more importantly, emotionaly.

 

Me too, RamRed.
At least Lucerno gave us something that made sense. The only thing worse than Darth Maul dying, was Qui-gon's introduction and explanation of midichlorians...

I take that back. Nothing is worse than Jar Jar.


What many people don't know about Lucas' direction is that in ROTS and in the ESB, Vader's ability and/or power was scaled back. It is easy to find what was cut from ROTS, but what was cut from ESB was even more dramatic.

When Luke rejects Vader and steps back, Darth Vader actually gripped Luke with the force and brought him back up to eye level, "You don't know the power of the dark Side of the Force" before releasing him to his free-fall.

Begin Sarcasm: Thank the good heavens that we now have the definition of midichlorians to explain why Vader was such a dissappointment. End Sarcasm.

 

Yoda fights two Sith -- Dooku, his former apprentice who he should know well, and Sidious. Both fights end in a draw due to circumstances that seem well beyond Yoda's control. We first see Mace fight on Geonosis in the arena, and then not again until his duel with Sidious. In that fight Sidious appears to fall to Mace in defeat, but on this point there is much disagreement. Many think Sidious pretends to suffer defeat after letting Mace taste the true depth of Sidious' dark powers. Once Mace senses who and what he is up against, he knows this 'darkness' must cease to exsit right here, right now! But Sidious knows Anakin is there, and that he, Sidious, has planted the seed of need in young Skywalker's mind that Padme will die without him.

Whether Palpatine was pretending or not, LucasFilms has made it clear that only three Jedi Knights/Masters were strong enough to fight against Palpatine - Anakin, Yoda and Mace.

 

there is a few possible scenarios here...
1) windu is the best swordsman out of all of them but weakest in force
2)yoda and emperor in my opinion were almost equal... sidious being a better swordsman and yoda being a better force user(he reflected sidious' lightning)
3)in the windu vs emperor duel emperor didnt try becuase he forsaw through the force that anakin would come and save him and that seeing windu attempt to kill him would seduce him.
4)anakin had the potential to become the most powerful out of all of them but he didnt because, he wasnt fully trained yet, needed to get rid of all of his anger and hate(anything else that has to do with the dark side), and it would take years more of training for him to reach full potential...

for those of you who are familiar with some type of prospect from a sport, he is a comparison...

a person with high potential is drafted
they then practice and get better
they than get good enough to play on the team
after a few years under their belt they get used to everything and then they finally fully develop...

 

This is a pretty good start at a breakdown. I would however change Anakin's knowledge of the force in that Anakin lacks the experience level of the other two (Yoda and Mace).

Anakin is of course very powerful, but over confident. That's what leads to him loosing against Obi-wan. He thought he could leap up, land behind Obi-wan and cut him down. The idea of Obi-wan beating him never even entered his mind- so neither did the idea of being cautious. This is a common problem w/ the Sith, Obi-wan defeats Maul b/c he's over confident, Anakin defeats Dooku b/c he's over confident, Obi-wan defeats Vader b/c he's over confident, and the Emperor is defeated b/c he's over confident. There's plenty of other examples in the movies using non- Sith or Jedi but it's getting redundant and off topic.

I also feel that Sids was acting weak against Mace. Look at his face as Anakin and Mace are talking. Sids face seems to say "yes... it's working..." His eyes quickly change back to looking afraid as Anakin looks down at him, like he's acting.

So my feeling is that the Emperor is the most powerful, but not too much more than Yoda. Anakin could have become more powerful than both of them but whether it's due to loss of midichlorines, emotional scarring, or simply physical injuries making him physically weaker, we can all agree that he doesn't become more powerful than emperor (though he's still pretty friggin' powerful).

 

Anakin has the strongest connection to the Force out of everyone, being that there is no biological father. Just the Midichlorians at work, regardless of who started the cell division that gave birth to Ankain, Anakin has the strongest connection due to this. But he does not have the most experience. According to Obi-wan, only Anakin has a higher Midichlorian count than Yoda. Apparently, no known Jedi has more than Yoda. But what sets him apart is that he is experienced in the ways of the Force than even Anakin. Yoda has spent his entire life to the study of the Force, training himself to be a very sufficent Jedi. This is why Anakin goes to Yoda. He knows more about the Force than anyone else in the Order.

 

What we know from the Yoda and Sideous duel is that they are very equally matched. Neither appeared stronger. Sideous won, but not by greater strength. You might say it was the will of the force. Otherwise it was luck on his side that Yoda could not find anything to cling to. As it stands nothing separates the two of them. If the dark-side gives a boost, then Yoda was stronger, relatively speaking...

Mace bested and overpowered Sideous. Sideous did not have time or opportunity to use his force powers, and hence had to use his swordsman skills, where ultimately he was not as strong as Windu. Mace was also able to deflect the lightning, but Sideous quit before he ever got to the point where he and Yoda was - but maybe the lightsaber would absorb and not contain the lightning the way Yoda did.

It is very difficult to say who was ultimately the strongest since no fight was similar. It seems, however, safe to say that Anakin was below Mace, Yoda and Sideous - and it would be strange if he was not considering his youth. Yoda sent OBW to duel Anakin, knowing that Anakin was not as strong, yet, as the Emperor - seeing that Yoda is not a coward, I don't think he took the easy way out there!

In a fight between Yoda and Sideous we see that the circumstances decide the outcome.
In a fight between Mace and Sideous we see that a brat decides the outcome

 

How about this? Anakin, Yoda and Mace were the only three Jedi capable of defeating Palpatine and we don't know who was the most powerful in the Force. In fact, why does it matter who was the most powerful?

 

Hahahahahhh!!!
Excellent point, RamRed... it doesn't matter.
Because they are all dead now anyways.