Saga Yoda's Personality: PT vs. OT

Does the personality of Yoda in the PT (Prequel Trilogy) contradict his personality found in the OT (Original Trilogy)?

I ask this mostly because I remember seeing a very sad, angry, serious, dark, twisted, Yoda in the Return of the Jedi where & when he tells Luke Skywalker that he will be very scared. I love Yoda and I am not here to talk about the fighting that Yoda does in the prequels. I am not here to argue for or against Yoda's mad skills of the prequels. I love seeing Yoda fight but I understand and respect the people that have problems with Yoda or with too much Jar Jar Binks or with the bad acting of baby Darth Vader or with the bad character development or other things. I like the prequels and I love the OT and the Clone Wars and Rebels and I just saw the comics with Maul and also the ones that take place after The New Hope. But never mind these details for now. I just want to talk about Yoda's personality.

What does Yoda do after going into hiding?

Did he dabble in the dark side?

Is Yoda telling Luke that he will be scared for facing Vader in Jedi or for things that may happen after Jedi or what?

I know Yoda is older in Empire and in Jedi, but it seems that he is so much more scarier and much more like evil looking or like more sad and mad and something or something when he is talking to Luke.

Yoda did not seem to be as sad or angry during the prequels. Yoda didn't seem to be angry when fighting Dooku or even Sideous.

What do you think?

 

When Yoda told Luke that he will be afraid, he wasn't being dark and twisted. He was telling him a simple fact of life that comes with training in the Jedi Arts, he will be afraid. All Jedi Padawans will face fear as fear is the path to the dark side. Yoda himself also faced fear during his initial Jedi trial when he was a young Padawan and again during his sojourn during the Clone Wars, as shown in "Destiny".

SERENITY: "At death, in order for you to preserve your identity, you must know yourself, your true self, and then let go. On that island dwells all that remains unconquered, what, in your existence, some call evil, otherwise known as fear, all which must be finally overcome before the journey can be taken. Free yourself, you must."

YODA: "A Jedi Master I am. Know all that dwells within I do. Mastered my weaknesses and conquered my fears I have."

SERENITY: "Have you? You must face your evil on that island and defeat it."


YODA: "How shall I complete my training?"

CONFUSION: "You must face the ultimate test, the ultimate seduction, the gravest of journeys."

SADNESS: "You will travel to Moraband."

YODA: "Moraband."

ANGER: "Journey through the ancient home world of the Sith. Face all that you fear, all that haunts your soul!"

Yoda's change is the result of what happened by the end of ROTS, with the Jedi Purge and all that was lost. But he is also wise enough to know that Luke's journey is just starting and part of that is that he will face himself and he knows that it will be a humbling experience for him.

 

Sure, that is true, you're right and I do agree. The greatest trial is facing yourself. Plus, the purge was a unique experience to endure. Yoda wanted to make sure that Luke would be focused enough not to fall to the dark side after Yoda goes to die.

As far as the story goes, this is ok. I understand what is happening as a reader.

I am not totally mad or confused or anything... all of this is ok to some extent....

I understand the process of becoming a jedi and that it important to be focused..... you must endure trails.....

I love the episodes in the clone wars in season 6 with yoda and the ancient creatures.....

and also the other episodes with the other planet and the father and and the son and the daughter


but

my concern here might be either in the appearance of yoda's personality...... that it might be a little too dark.... like too much of a change...

or in the editing of the films in the OT and then also in the way they made the PT....

it might be in the makeup... in the lighting...

in the way that the yoda puppet moved in Jedi.....

and in Yoda's like drugged out eyes in Jedi.....

it just seem that Yoda became more serious and bipolar after the purge

and I wonder if Yoda was an alcoholic before the purge or not

and I wonder if the bipolar split between silly yoda and killer yoda in Empire and Jedi is acceptable or not

I am ok with it

but Yoda was already about 800 years old in the PT

and Yoda should have already developed that bipolar split before the PT

but I guess this is what happens to jedi after the purge

but Ben didn't become as biploar as Yoda

why didn't Ben become bipolar?

and how is Asoka doing after the purge?

 

Welcome to the boards Joey Arnold. This is a very interesting post with its drug, alcohol and bipolar references.

To address the original question, I would say no, there's not really a contradiction between the two trilogies when it comes to Yoda's personality. In the PT Yoda is earnest, determined, but mostly quite calm and self assured. Post purge, there is an understandable change as everything that he has so long stood for has been all but destroyed under his watch. There's a world weariness about him. A sense of trepidation. The seemingly contradictory 'bipolar' behaviour in TESB is just an act to test Luke.

 

It does on purpose - to show what he has learned

In the OT alone, I never really thought much of Yoda. His development in the PT adds a whole new layer of meaning to his characterization in the OT and I can appreciate it much more. It feels more fulfilling and satisfying to see him go from overly sure of his own abilities to the more wisdom oriented master he is

I think that the duel with Palpatine alone shows visually his development from the beginning with his defeat foreshadowing and answering what he would become. The novelization beautifully points out that it was only during the duel that Yoda really discovered what he had done wrong - he relied too much on the old ways and thought the issue could be solved by defeating the enemy in combat rather than progress into new techniques and use wisdom and the Force to prevent such conflicts from occurring. From what we see of him, we could easily infer that he had realized something like this

"Failed, I have" refers to much more than just being defeated in the duel, and Frank Oz delivers that line with such a powerful weight

I'm tired lol, it's hard for me right now to state what really makes Yoda so special to me; it would make him a much less interesting, static character were he characterized just like he was in the OT

 

I think even before the PT, the implication is there in the OT that Yoda has taken a beating, physically, emotionally, metaphorically, and that this has helped to shape and transform his character at that point. The PT explains it well though.

 

In the OT alone, Yoda is the mysterious Jedi Master.

In the PT, one of the biggest things, fans remember is that Yoda can fight. Which I think is good thing. It adds more to "size matters not". Also age matters not. Not only physical age, but also that you're never too old to learn. Yoda is flawed, which really adds to his character.

 

The dark tone with Yoda in TESB is that the film itself was dark and so we see the duality. First, we see Yoda testing Luke's patience. Then we see him make his true feelings about the boy known, as Luke has become a disappointment to him. Then we the test by which Yoda will judge what kind of man Luke is trying to become by sending him into the cave, just as he went into it and the island on the Force planet. But then we see Yoda start to come around as Luke begins to catch on and evolve, all leading to his departure and Yoda's disappointment in Luke. He's seeing history repeat itself and he is not pleased at all.

 

I found it to be a natural character progression. He started out as the head of a powerful order, which was destroyed, sending him into 20 years of exile. Of course he's going to go from a guy who's very serious to someone who appears to be slightly crazy.

 

I prefer him in the OT, but the PT added a whole other layer to him as a character that has helped me become even more invested for his scenes in a OT. That being said, my favorite Yoda scene resides in AOTC when he's teaching the younglings how to use a lightsaber. He came off a lot like his future self in the OT in that scene.

 

I actually don't really see much difference between the two versions. Both have a bit of sense of humor, and both know when its time to be serious. Its true he changed a bit in the OT (my favorite version), but I think its because he knew Luke was the only real hope for the Jedi and thus much more weight was on his shoulders to train Luke.

 

There is no contradiction between his personality in the two different trilogies.

He's still extremely wise, he's still a true Jedi who never dabbled in the dark side.

He is not 'angrier' or more aggressive in the OT. He's still generally calm and helpful to Luke. Obviously his character has changed, but it hasn't contradicted his personality. It just shows the emotional trials he's been put through.

 

It sounds as if Yoda may have been a little impatient in "The Empire Strikes Back". In such a short space of time, he saw history repeating itself?

 

I've noticed different personality in Yoda too. In the PT he's always calm and serious, instead in the OT he seems to be emotionally unstable. I think it's normal if we consider that he had lost the Jedi Order in which he devoted his entire life for centuries and then he had spent 20 years alone in a desolate place.

 

Like other here I don't see the difference between OT Yoda and PT Yoda as a problem, more a reflection of the things that happened to him in between.

I didn't see it this way. I saw his initial silliness as an act to test Luke but not as instability. In fact in those early scenes I think he reminds me strongly of the EU's Master Zao who, like an real-world Taoist master can use humour, ordinariness and even silliness in teaching. I also don't think he was necessarily alone as he may have had Qui-Gon Jinn to talk to from time to time.

That said, I think there is a discernable difference between the OT and the PT but I suspect that Lucas' later info on Yoda explains that to some extent. Apparently Obi-Wan was originally going to give Luke his training but Lucas decided he'd become 'too iconic' (I think that's how he phrased it) and so he killed him off. Then of course he needed another character for the training and he came up with 'A two foot little green guy'. Apparently Lucas still doesn't know where Yoda comes from. He regards him as a magical being who appears, does what he does and then leaves - sounds like Mary Poppins to me!! lol The point is though that Lucas had no back story for Yoda during teh OT. So I think in the OT Yoda was just that - a magical type being who teaches Luke, but in the PT Lucas needed to fill out his character much more and anchor it in reality. I think that's why we get more of the silliness (or bipolar / unstable stuff) in the OT and less in the PT as he goes from magical being to grounded real being between the two sets of films.

It does make sense to ask this question about Yoda - nice one Joey - good quesiton!

 

Well he's all jokey in the scene in AOTC, with the younglings and makes fun of Obi-Wan. So he always had it in him.

 

No, there is no contradiction; only development.

 

Personally, although I like the PT better, I don't see Yoda's personality in terms of PT or OT. I view it as one well-written character that develops over the chronological time in which the films take place.

 

Yoda is noticeably a touch senile in the OT. I think he has a little bit of cabin fever being couped up on that planet by himself for so many years (of course this is an assumption until Disney expands on his story). He is at the end of his life and I'm sure he was trying to make the best of his situation. It seams obvious to me that Lucas purposely gave Yoda a more professional demeanor in the PT. I personally like the contrast in his personality from the OT to the PT. It gave me a sense of realism.

 

Yes. There was much anger in both Skywalker men. Both rushed off to rescue their loved ones because of attachment issues. Both had much fear in them. Both disregarded the advice of their Masters. That's why he says, "Told you, I did. Reckless is he. Now matters are worse." He was hesitant to train Luke because he was a disappointment to him, but he put faith in the boy and what Serenity had revealed to him years ago. Then the boy goes and runs off and you can see the disappointment in his face when Luke tells Artoo to start the ship.

And no, there is no senility. There is only testing of Luke's patience. Notice that he stops as soon as Luke throws his temper tantrum and he turns to talk to Obi-wan.

 

I'm not really sure... he is a wise Jedi in the Prequels, but not only wise, a very good fighter still at his old age as we saw in III. In the Originals, he was a lot more... crazy, but he never really lost his way, making him still pretty wise. Of course, he was crazy justified, he lost everything he had and lived on a creepy swamp planet, where he had to hide from pretty much everyone. After two decades of that - really, after one day - I would lose my mind as well.